454 swap options ?

[Sdc77]

Hello guys,
Is there a compatibility (direct fit) between Mopar engines and GM transmissions ?
Let me explain my idea :
The 454 is fun, but it likes fuel too much to be used in France like we do (about 100 hours per year).
I would like to swap it. But V8 are rare here. Especially 350 GM. They generally are still in their car, with low mileage.

Bur here in Europe, 1 car has been sold in mass, with tones of parts, and cheap V8's
It's the ZJ/ZG Jeep Grand Cherokee V8 5.2L ( 1993-1998 ). We can find it for 500$ or even for free when transmission is dead, mostly it's solenoids, but Chrysler France prefer asking 6000$ for changing the transmission instead of opening it ... I had 2 Grand and 1 get a solenoid dead, the do ask me this amount of money and I got it live again for 150$ ...

So, my idea is to find a Grand for free or few bucks, with a running V8, and start to work on it for a marinizing thing.

But, can I swap the 454 for a 318 mopar without modification on the transmission or engine mounts ?

[villain]

short answer is no. completely different animal. the only thing they share is the fact that they are a 4 stroke engine.

[Sdc77]

Thank you villain, I will then look for a LT1 ...

[jasun]

Just out of curiosity, how much is Gas per Liter in France?

[Sdc77]

it's 1.50€ per liter for "95 unleaded gazoline"
Means a 30min ride cession is about (with the 454 - 25~ Liters per hour consumption) 19€, about $25 USD
Interresting isn't it ;)

[jasun]

Means it is over 300 usd to fill the tank!! Can't blame you for wanting to change!!

[Sdc77]

You're right for the tank

Most of cars here are 1.2L to 2.0L engine powered (75% are diesel).
When I say I have a 7.4L gas in the boat, people make fun of me. They can't imagine it exists, and then they can't imagine how much fuel it drinks.

"bigger is better" is definatly not what we use to think here. Maybe something like "smallest and diesel is the way to go".
But ridding behind the boat with a smoky diesel is not what I expect.

That's why I'm looking to swap the 454 ...

[Sdc77]

Hmmm start to think about a Rover V8 3.9L ; 4.0L or 4.6L.
Those engines are an aluminium 3.5L Buick V8 based, we find it everywhere here in Europe.
It will fit directly on the transmission.
It's not very powerful (225 HP for a 4.6 ; 200HP for a 4.0), but, with a good pitched propeller, I think it can move the Saltare with half fuel consumption.
It will also need heavy loads to match the 454 weight and keep the Wake size as it's right now.

Any advises ? Pros/cons ?

[Jetlink]

Going to a smaller and less powerful engine though in theory should reduce your fuel consumption might actually increase your fuel consumption. Follow me here, the 454 might not need to run WOT when you're riding however, a smaller engine making less power might need to keep the throttle buried more to achieve the same amount of work, thereby increasing your overall gas usage in the long run. I feel your pain man but I'd do some more research on the matter before you go pulling the trigger on anything.

As a reference point, my comp and my buddies sunsport have the exact same engine, transmission and prop. My boat weighs less than his and I use less gas doing the same stuff than he does in his boat.

[Sdc77]

Yes I thought about it.
But we have to consider every parameters :
The Saltare is a light boat, even for a 23'
The 454 has a low compression ratio, carburetor, classical ignition
We mostly do wakeboarding on it
I live in France, gas is 1.50€/L

Now I would like to burn less fuel.

A friend who's got a 20' 2006 Malibu wakesetter with a 325hp 350ci EFI engine. His boat is about 1900kg and burns 15L/hour

The saltare is probably the same weight but burns 25 to 30L/h

Swaping for a smaller engine with EFI can save me 5L/h even more. It's probably nothing in US with cost of gas, but here, I will save alot of money.

So what to do ? Trying to modernize the 454 with TBI + HV Electronic ignition ?
If I go for a car MPI smaller engine, I will need to buy marine exhausts, a new propeller ...

Not sure 1 solution is better or cheaper than the other.

I probably should start to upgrade my setup with a Edelbrock carb + a new HV Electronic ignition + a fine tune. Maybe with a air/fuel ratio gauge + O2 sensor ?

[Sirgonz]

Get one of those fuel sipping turbo diesels you guys have over there same torque LESS fuel? Is there a GM diesel that's popular over there?

[Sdc77]

Diesel smell bad. Good idea for boating, but for wakeboarding, it will be undesirable.
And diesel fuel tend to be as expensive as gas here in France, and will be soon even more expensive. Government wants to favorize green cars, like LPG, E85, Hybrid, Electric etc.
And what to say about the sound of a diesel engine, especially at idle ...

No, realy I prefer staying on a gas V8 engine, and try to hit a 15L/H consumption

[Kma4444]

The components exist to use an "LA" series Mopar engine with your transmission. There were lots of boats built with small Chryslers in them and you would need to find the swap parts to do it. Probably wouldn't cost all that much to get the required pieces, bellhousing, mounts etc... Not sure if there is much of it over on your side of the pond but it is definitely available.

[Sdc77]

Thanks Kevin, that's a good news ! So the Grand Cherokee 5.2 MPI V8 is still an option if I find the bellhousing for my Velvet model 10-18-002 transmission

[Sdc77]

Seems to be this part ?

http://www.surplusman.com/Detail.php?itemid=3471

[Sdc77]

Does anyone know what is the torque rate of the PCM 454 ?
I can't find this information. Maybe it's not important in boating ?

[Sdc77]

Finally I will go for a Rochester quadrajet carburetor, and a 50KV HEI distributor.
The 454 will stay in the Saltare ;)

[Sdc77]

Don't worry man, it's already what we do. Everybody who do wakeboarding behind this boat comes with a 20L fuel can ;)