Budget Sub and Amp

[jasun]

Anyone have any recommendations for 1 sub and a an amp that would be decent qualtiy for the price?

I know that is all vague, but looking for some recomendations...

[wotan2525]

How loud do you want to be? A single Alpine Type R 12" and ~1000watts (Hifonics or a PPI S1300.1d) would be under $500w/ a box and be more than most people need.

Here's a decent package that is almost the exact same thing (most of these class D amps are all the same on the insides, NVX is just Sonics "house" band.)

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_52407_1000W-Alpine-SWR-12D2-Subwoofer-NVX-Bass-Package.html

[jasun]

Are these marine grade, or do they even have to be Marine grade?

[wotan2525]

I'm sure others will chime in -- generally speaking, marine grade means that they are splash/moisture resistant. If you're not around salt-water, you'll probably be fine with non-marine grade components. I've got my sub under my helm and my amps in the odd space under my dashboard. Neither of them get wet or have the possibility of getting splashed.

You could spend twice the money on WetSounds.......

[jasun]

You could spend twice the money on WetSounds.......

lol, I like where your head is.... I was thinking car audio, but it has been 15 years since I had my Infinity Kappa 12's with my 1000 watt JBL Amp.in my 89 Cougar....
I loved those...

Does Infinity still make good stuff?? I Found they still make the Kappas (http://www.amazon.com/INFINITY-SERIES-KAPPA-100-9W-PERFORMANCE-SUBWOOFER/dp/B002MXQAAC/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1373569423&sr=8-9&keywords=Infinity+kappa) and found them on Amazon for like 120 for 10"... They have Reference Models (http://www.amazon.com/Infinity-Reference-1262w-1200-Watt-High-Performance/dp/B0028AYIXK/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1373569467&sr=1-1&keywords=Infinity+subs)for like 60 bucks for a 12".... I know you get what you pay for, but I am not looking to rattle my boat apart, just to give the 6 1/2" some depth...

Anyone have any experice with these??

[kriley]

I just put a new 10" JL sub, 700 watt JL amp and Exile tower speakers in - Ordered them from EarMark Audio - Clearance items - Saved a ton of cash - Amp was 1/2 off paid about $200 and $150 for the sub which was 1/2 off as well - the Exile XM 9's where 1/2 off - had a small scratch on the bottom (took black paint and touched it up)- Call and talk to Oden! also we have a discount - pm me and I will send you the code if you are interested

[Wylietunes]

Jasun,

If you are looking to balance out your in-boat system by filling in those missing low notes, then a single 10" woofer in a simple sealed enclosure with 150-200 watts rms is all thats needed. A single voice coil 4 ohm sub bridged on a 2 chnl amp will be a very reasonable setup. Also, knowing more about what your current setup is, you might be able to re-purpose or reconfigure and existing amp to drive the in-boats and a new sub.

True marine gear is not necessary, but it has its advantages. Marine subs will have a rubber surround, all composite cone and an aluminum or composite basket. Stay away from a pure paper coned sub, even laminated. In a sealed enclosure, a paper on the back and composite on the front is ok. Even stamped steel basket is not not too big of an issue for a trailered fresh water boat.

[jasun]

I have a Sony CDXM30 52 W X4 and 4 Infinity Reference 225 Watts peak power handling and 4 Ohm impedance ....

Any recomendation Wylie? Again, not looking to break the bank, but want it to just have good sound.

[Sdc77]

A dedicated amplifier is needed for such speakers if you want "sound" and bass, instead of "noise" from the cd player's amplifier ...
Especially a SONY player ! I never heard such poison from a source unit than SONY's.

Forget about that brand, they make very good home things, but for marine and cars it sucksssssss
Go for Pioneer, Kenwood, Rockford, MB Quart, Clarion etc.

My setup is actually a cheap and powerful combo (more powerful than the full JL audio setup from a Mastercraft) :

Pioneer DEH-6300SD USB, AUX, FM, iPod / iPhone de contrôle : $100
Pioneer marine remote CD-MR70 : $60
BOSS MR650 marine speakers (in the boat) x4 : $90
BOSS MR695 marine speakers (on the tower) x4 : $128
MTX Road Thunder RT12-04 RT SUBWOOFER : $100 (home made enclosure : $0)
Cars used amplifiers (a old school MTX, and a old school ORION) : $200
wires + connectors + fuses etc : $150

You can go for class-D full range amplifiers, they give good power and less amps consumption than class-AB.
If I can, I would like to switch to the Polk Audio PA D5000.5 for all my installation.

Hope it helps

[jasun]

Would I need 2 amps if I was just running 1 sub? one for the 6 1/2's and one for the sub? Is a mono the best for a sub? I have been looking at used gear on craigs list, but havnt pulled the trigger on anything. How many watts is your MTX and Orion?

As far as your comment on the Pioneer, I harbor the same feeling you do about Sony... I had several junk pioneer decks in my car and finally went to Sony... That is why I went with them here too. how big of amp would I need for my 6 1/2's? what about that Infinity Refernce sub?

[Sdc77]

Of my own experience, (My first job was seller/mounting hifi in cars), Infinity made in the past real HIFI speakers/amps. With the kappa (green speakers, tweeter EMIT etc.) and BETA speakers.
My brother recently bought a Reference 2 ohms Infinity kit, I was realy frustrated about the result. Sound was "acid", with omnipresent crying tweeters.
I don't know about your sub and speakers, take a look at the X-max and sensitivity. In a boat, you need pressure to hear music. Bet on high sensitivity speakers, HIFI style (Infinity is/was good IMO), with powerful US amplifiers. I would recommand Rockord, MTX, Orion, Polk, hifonics, kicker, Autotek, JL audio, Cerwin Vega, some Crunch are good.
Forget about japanese amplifiers, lack of power for a boat IMO.

You can go for a 4 channel amp to run 4x 6 1/2' (connected in parallel) + 1 SUB (4 ohms single coil or 2x 2 ohms). A mono amp for a Sub will be interresting in class-D for multi coil or multi sub application. For a low budget, prefer a good 4 channel class-D

Here is my setup connection :
2x channel MTX 62.5w/channel for [4 speakers // wirrered in the boat, that's 120Wrms on each, high pass filter @ 100 HZ]
4x channel ORION 75w/channel for [4 speakers // wirrered on the tower, that's 150Wrms on each, high pass filter @ 80 HZ] on channel 1/2 + [the subwoofre bridged, 300Wrms, low pass filter @ 80HZ] on channel 3/4

Note that my Pioneer unit has 3x RCA outputs @ 4V. Voltage is important as it gives more dynamics and power. Most of low prices CD players are 2V ...

[Wylietunes]

I have a Sony CDXM30 52 W X4 and 4 Infinity Reference 225 Watts peak power handling and 4 Ohm impedance ....

Any recomendation Wylie? Again, not looking to break the bank, but want it to just have good sound.

A Kicker KM-10 is a great sound sub and very musical (SQ) and works great in a simple 1.0 ft3 sealed enclosure. Or if you have space, you can get it in its own enclosure part # SKM-10. Pair it up with a full-range Class-D KXM400.4 marine 4 chnl. This will drive each in-boat @ 50W rms each and sub @ 200W rms. Or the KXM800.5 full-range class-D 5 chnl. This amp will deliver the same power, but with the sub on its own dedicated sub chnl, you have the flexibility to add a 3rd pair of in-boats. The 5 chnl will also deliver up to 400W rms to a 2 ohm sub-woofer.

A couple of alternate amp option would the the Arc XDi804 or the XDi805.

[jonyb]

Wet Sounds HT1 and XS12 would sound great in the right enclosure. If you didn't have room for that, an XS-10FA would work well too.

[Sdc77]

Jasun, best to tell us your budget, then we can help you on a low cost system.
Wetsound doesn't sound cheap to me ...

[jonyb]

SDC, that's not true about Wet Sounds.....

I've had customers in the past that had low budgets, and most, if not all, have ended up with Wet Sounds equipment. Since the new HT line has been out, they've put themselves in the range of a lot more budgets then they had in the past.

[villain]

Johnyb, are you talking about the xst towers? If so how do they sound? Are they better than the kickers I used to have?

[jonyb]

Not necessarily, just the brand in general, since someone said they sounded expensive.

The XST towers are just a set of tower cans with XS-65 or XS-650's. They sound just like the coax's do, but are designed to be mounted on a tower. The 650's, in my opinion, sound a lot better than the Kicker tower speakers. I had a customer bring a set of those by to be installed and I wasn't very impressed with them. I don't think he was either. The 650's have a sound unique of their own, and you really have to hear a set to understand how good they sound.

[villain]

Might have to give them a try. Looking for cheep towers, but don't want the same crappy kickers I had on my old boat. Going to be going with a rev8 six pack this winter, need tunes till then

[Wylietunes]

SDC, that's not true about Wet Sounds.....

I've had customers in the past that had low budgets, and most, if not all, have ended up with Wet Sounds equipment. Since the new HT line has been out, they've put themselves in the range of a lot more budgets then they had in the past.

Exactly! Its also not an apples to apples comparison to put Wet Sounds, at MSRP, up next to a 3 year old discontinued model amp listed on an internet discount site.

[jonyb]

Don't get me started on internet discount sites.... You guys haven't seen poor service until you have to deal with those poor excuse for companies.

[Wylietunes]

Might have to give them a try. Looking for cheep towers, but don't want the same crappy kickers I had on my old boat. Going to be going with a rev8 six pack this winter, need tunes till then

Ive been a Kicker installer for over 5 years and they are FAR from crappy. Now, what someone likes and dislikes the sound of, is totally in the ears of the listener, so I tend to not interject what I personally like the sound of.

Im willing to bet your dislike with the Kickers, resulting in the opinion of Crappy, is due to a number of things, and not the actual brand, build quality and sound quality of the speakers.

What model Kickers?
Are they in small aluminum pods?
How are they powered
How is the amp tuned?
What are your overall tower speaker goals?

All of the above will impact your perception, and can be duplicated with any brand speaker on the market. Even an awesome speaker like xs-650. Id be willing to bet that if you swapped the drivers only, and made no other changes, the results would be about the same. Yes, they will sound different, but that doesnt equal "better" when the root cause of the poor results remained the same.

[villain]

They were the ktm6's. every year the surround would crack. Working for a tige dealer, we also carry wetsounds. So getting a deal on them is no biggie. Just would rather drop 300 on a pair now than over extend myself on the 6 pack that I'm saving for.

[Sdc77]

jonyb, your package solution is $680. That's why I'm asking jasun's budget, that doesn't sounds a budget system to me.
I had the amazing chance to ride and use a Mastercraft X35 for 3 years, with 4x componant tower speakers (http://www.wakeboards.com/MasterCraft-OEM-Tower-Speakers-with-Lights-p/mc_tower_speakers_lights.htm), 1 JL A sub and 4 coponents in the boat, + 3 JL A amplifiers.
This system is about $6000-7000, and was sounding great, BUT, not as powerful as my actual $600 setup (including amps, sub, tower speakers, in-boat speakers). I surely loose some quality definition, but, nobody hear it as I choose good amps with the right filtering/tuning and "hifi" speakers.

That's just my feeling, you don't need to spend more money to have more sound ;)

[jonyb]

jonyb, your package solution is $680. That's why I'm asking jasun's budget, that doesn't sounds a budget system to me.
I had the amazing chance to ride and use a Mastercraft X35 for 3 years, with 4x componant tower speakers (http://www.wakeboards.com/MasterCraft-OEM-Tower-Speakers-with-Lights-p/mc_tower_speakers_lights.htm), 1 JL A sub and 4 coponents in the boat, + 3 JL A amplifiers.
This system is about $6000-7000, and was sounding great, BUT, not as powerful as my actual $600 setup (including amps, sub, tower speakers, in-boat speakers). I surely loose some quality definition, but, nobody hear it as I choose good amps with the right filtering/tuning and "hifi" speakers.

That's just my feeling, you don't need to spend more money to have more sound ;)

$680 at retail. Does anybody sell at retail anymore?

[jasun]

well i know it has been awhile since I updated, but I finally pulled the Trigger.


Got a Rockford Fosgate R400-4D and an MTX Audio RTS12-04 based on the recomendations from our buddy in France Sdc77

http://i.seimg.net/images/863592/main/r4004d.jpg
http://i.seimg.net/images/700408/main/rts1204.jpg

Built a box and got it all hooked up. Sounds Great for under 300 bucks! Ill throw some pics up when I take some. Thanks for all the recomendations!!

[Sdc77]

Thanks for feedback Jeff ;)
Hope you will enjoy your budget installation as good as I enjoy mine ;)

What king of enclosure do you build ? Sealed or vented ? Mine is sealed and rocks very much more than the expensive free air JL audio that was in the MC X35 ...

Do you have a tower on the boat ? Do you plan to put tower speakers ?

Keep posting pics and feeling ;)

[jasun]

I want to make some changes to it this winter. I have enough MDF left to build another box so I plan to do that and do a better job wrapping it. The current box, i bought the wrong carpet and was too impatient so just wrapped it. Looks like this, but noone can see it. I am using a sealed box with the Factory Recomended DIMs.

I do not have a tower so no towe speakers as of yet. Maybe someday. I didnt get to wakeboard near as much as I would have liked so I just went with a pylon this year.

[Torque]

I went really simple. I added a powered bass tube to my Comp. I put it under the deck on the drivers side. Works perfect. Not overwhelming.

[Smitty75]

I have a new mtx 5 channel amp listed in the classifieds. Will easily power 4 cabin speakers and a sub, or 2 tower speakers and a sub. Great budget amp, just looking to get some of my money back on it. Will take $200 shipped if you interested.

[ts6mnewbie]

I went really simple. I added a powered bass tube to my Comp. I put it under the deck on the drivers side. Works perfect. Not overwhelming.

I did the same thing in ours this spring. Also added 4 Polk 6 1/2s and a cheap MB Quart amp to replace quite possibly the worst stereo EVER to be put in a boat. The results far exceeded my expectations. It's nice when that happens.

[Cusefan78]

Smitty. What are the specs on the amp. I might be interested.

As for kickers being crap you are out of your mind. I have a 4 in my labrisa and they are loud and clear to the point my neighbors can hear me coming down the lake crystal clear. If you had crappy ones the crossovers where not set right. One more thing about marine and auto speakers. Marine grade speakers tend to throw sound in a wider range then auto. Auto speakers are in an enclosed space so the sound will bounce around a car where marine speakers have nothing to bounce off. For a sub it won't make a difference. Good wires and crossovers make all the difference in sound. If you use cheap radio shack garbage your sound is going to suffer.

[ramzak]

I just swapped out the system in my 2008 Launch 22SSV.

I will sell you the whole system for $400

10 Kenwood 6.5" speakers
1 10" sub
2 amps

free kenwood head unit. all marine grade

[jasun]

I have 4 6.5" Infinity Reference and the 12" MTX running off the Rockford Fosgate amp. It all sounds great! I have a Sony head unit that I use. All in all, I have $140 in the 6.5", 160 in the deck, 90 for sub and 180 for the amp. I am very pleased with the sound and the 12 fits right under the helm and is out of the way. Bumbs hard in the sealed enclosure but doesnt make it obnoxious... unless I want to me :p

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00292XT2I/ref=oh_details_o06_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0016010CA/ref=oh_details_o06_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1