Installed Dual Batt.. need some help

[SeattleBoat]

Hey guys.. very new to the forum. Was bummed this site was down last month for so long when I picked up my '88 Saltare w/ the 454 PCM, was so eager to learn!

To summarize, the boat came w/ 2 batteries.. previous owner had them wired up together. It started fine.. but died on the water once at idle. I connected the 2nd battery that was disconnected, and it fired right back up. When I came home, I decided to be "smart" and install a Blue Sea battery switch along w/ their ACR charging system. I used 2 gauge cable for the whole install and ran 2 80amp fuses between the battery and the ACR unit.

In addition to the above, I decided to install a new alternator from Nautique Parts, the Mando RA097006A

All excited, I turned the key today and blew the starter battery fuse I installed. And with that, I just can't get it to crank. Batteries were charged fully last week. Not sure if they lost some charge during the install.

I put the old Motorola alternator in, nothing. I then disconnected my dual battery setup and just took the original boat power and ground, tied it to the battery with the old alternator and nothing. New alternator., nothing. I grabbed a newish battery out of my buddies boat, nothing. Just a click.. but not enough juice to turn it at all.

What could it be? I'm so tired... lol

I was a bit confused on the wiring of the alternators. I assume that the yellow line, which connects to purple on the boat, is the exciter hook up (EXC). Right? Anyone have any ideas? Should I scrap this 2 battery ACR setup and go with something simpler?

1967819679'

[michael hunter]

I don't know the system you installed . Start with the 50 amp red breaker at the back of the engine above the trans. Recheck your wiring. You spent a ton of money on that stuff you should ask what to buy first.

[secondsupra2004]

Hey guys.. very new to the forum. Was bummed this site was down last month for so long when I picked up my '88 Saltare w/ the 454 PCM, was so eager to learn!

To summarize, the boat came w/ 2 batteries.. previous owner had them wired up together. It started fine.. but died on the water once at idle. I connected the 2nd battery that was disconnected, and it fired right back up. When I came home, I decided to be "smart" and install a Blue Sea battery switch along w/ their ACR charging system. I used 2 gauge cable for the whole install and ran 2 80amp fuses between the battery and the ACR unit.

In addition to the above, I decided to install a new alternator from Nautique Parts, the Mando RA097006A

All excited, I turned the key today and blew the starter battery fuse I installed. And with that, I just can't get it to crank. Batteries were charged fully last week. Not sure if they lost some charge during the install.

I put the old Motorola alternator in, nothing. I then disconnected my dual battery setup and just took the original boat power and ground, tied it to the battery with the old alternator and nothing. New alternator., nothing. I grabbed a newish battery out of my buddies boat, nothing. Just a click.. but not enough juice to turn it at all.

What could it be? I'm so tired... lol

I was a bit confused on the wiring of the alternators. I assume that the yellow line, which connects to purple on the boat, is the exciter hook up (EXC). Right? Anyone have any ideas? Should I scrap this 2 battery ACR setup and go with something simpler?

1967819679'
I know the advantage of dual batteries as I just installed them this summer on my boat. I did not wire in an ACR, I just have a dual battery charger that I plug in when I get home. I have a Perko switch and I alternate batteries on each trip.
First, the alternator has nothing to do with the engine cranking. You need to figure out why it is blowing fuses when you try and start. Go back to the original setup(disconnect one of your batteries) and check all connections and grounds. If it didn't blow before, you have something hooked up wrong. I'm also not sure what type of starter solenoid/relay your boat has. You may have shorted that during your new hookup.

[Wylietunes]

and blew the starter battery fuse I installed

Is this one of the 80A fuses installed between the batteries and ACR? If so, then you have something regarding the new switch and ACR that is majorly wired incorrect.

The alternator will not have any effect on the engine starting or not. Only charging or not charging once engine is running. So, if you are unsure of how the new alternator needs to be wired, put the old back in as it was originally for now.

To diagnose this, you will need a digital volt/ohm meter, and know how to use it. Once the cranking issue is resolved, you are going to need an accurate schematic for building the dual bank system.

[majortom]

Agree with secondsupra2004, alternator is unrelated. Starter motor isn’t getting power or sufficient power. Open circuit, blown fuse, dead/low battery or bad relay.

Which battery in your picture is the starter battery? The one on the left is pretty old, 2017. Both batteries Known good and charged?

The fuse you blew, is that the 80amp fuses on the ACR or other fuses not shown in the picture?

FWIW, the 2 gauge on the ACR is overkill. Those wires need only to be sized for you max alternator or battery charger charging current. Fuses sized to protect wire size.

[SeattleBoat]

Agree with secondsupra2004, alternator is unrelated. Starter motor isn’t getting power or sufficient power. Open circuit, blown fuse, dead/low battery or bad relay.

Which battery in your picture is the starter battery? The one on the left is pretty old, 2017. Both batteries Known good and charged?

The fuse you blew, is that the 80amp fuses on the ACR or other fuses not shown in the picture?

FWIW, the 2 gauge on the ACR is overkill. Those wires need only to be sized for you max alternator or battery charger charging current. Fuses sized to protect wire size.I wasn't sure about wire size to the ACR because it comes directly off the battery.. so i just went 2 guage with 80 amp fuses in between the battery and ACR. What size do you recommend off the battery to the ACR.. i don't mind swapping the wire out.

Thanks for the info!

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[SeattleBoat]

Is this one of the 80A fuses installed between the batteries and ACR? If so, then you have something regarding the new switch and ACR that is majorly wired incorrect.

The alternator will not have any effect on the engine starting or not. Only charging or not charging once engine is running. So, if you are unsure of how the new alternator needs to be wired, put the old back in as it was originally for now.

To diagnose this, you will need a digital volt/ohm meter, and know how to use it. Once the cranking issue is resolved, you are going to need an accurate schematic for building the dual bank system.I'm pretty sure all the wires are routed correctly. I did put in the original alternator and wired it back to stock.. but no dice. Maybe the battery is too low? I had them checked.. both were good.

Yes.. that 80amp fuse is between battery and ACR.

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[SeattleBoat]

I know the advantage of dual batteries as I just installed them this summer on my boat. I did not wire in an ACR, I just have a dual battery charger that I plug in when I get home. I have a Perko switch and I alternate batteries on each trip.
First, the alternator has nothing to do with the engine cranking. You need to figure out why it is blowing fuses when you try and start. Go back to the original setup(disconnect one of your batteries) and check all connections and grounds. If it didn't blow before, you have something hooked up wrong. I'm also not sure what type of starter solenoid/relay your boat has. You may have shorted that during your new hookup.Appreciate the feedback.. i will check the starter! I have a few fuses out by it.. but both were good. Will look again tomorrow..

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[SeattleBoat]

I don't know the system you installed . Start with the 50 amp red breaker at the back of the engine above the trans. Recheck your wiring. You spent a ton of money on that stuff you should ask what to buy first.Not sure if i saw that breaker.. will look tomorrow. Much appreciated!

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[Wylietunes]

I'm pretty sure all the wires are routed correctly. I did put in the original alternator and wired it back to stock.. but no dice. Maybe the battery is too low? I had them checked.. both were good.

Yes.. that 80amp fuse is between battery and ACR.

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Your 2ga and 80A fuse is fine, id leave it as long as the terminations are correct. You've already proven it works, as the fuse blew v's the 2ga melting down

However, I dont see how that fuse blew. Seems that there was a dead short between the 2 batteries. As if one was reversed polarity. Is the control ground the only circuit on the ACR, you are using? Thats one of the small blade terminals along the bottom. Or are you using the SI?

[SeattleBoat]

Your 2ga and 80A fuse is fine, id leave it as long as the terminations are correct. You've already proven it works, as the fuse blew v's the 2ga melting down

However, I dont see how that fuse blew. Seems that there was a dead short between the 2 batteries. As if one was reversed polarity. Is the control ground the only circuit on the ACR, you are using? Thats one of the small blade terminals along the bottom. Or are you using the SI?The ACR is connected to the small ground, going to a bussbar. I also have the LED going to the accessory side on the switch.. maybe i should change that to the house? Not that it is causing the issue.

I do have a question in regards to the bussbar. I connected the ground from the engine to the bussbar, along with the negative battery terminals to the bussbar. Do you think it's wise to have the engine ground go to the bussbar or should it go directly to the negative battery terminal instead?

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[Wylietunes]

I also have the LED going to the accessory side on the switch

So you are using the remote indicator (LED) terminal off the ACR? That output terminal is wired to the negative side of an LED and the LED is wired to switch? Or sis you run a wire from the LED terminal direct to the switch with no LED in the middle with correct polarity?

Your ground BUS is fine, as long as the ground cables between the BUS and batteries is of proper gauge.

Also looks like there are only 3 cables exiting the switch. I presume main starter cable, cranking battery and house battery. Are there no house loads?

[SeattleBoat]

The red 50 amp circuit breaker at the back of the engine is not responding to me pushing it in. I'm assuming it's supposed to click? I think that might be my problem.. and if so I'm wondering why it popped in the first place.

I'll get a new one installed and run everything stock to at least get the engine to turn. Appreciate all your suggestions.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210904/26da709e91b4ce47e3dc348480380513.jpg

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[SeattleBoat]

So you are using the remote indicator (LED) terminal off the ACR? That output terminal is wired to the negative side of an LED and the LED is wired to switch? Or sis you run a wire from the LED terminal direct to the switch with no LED in the middle with correct polarity?

Your ground BUS is fine, as long as the ground cables between the BUS and batteries is of proper gauge.

Also looks like there are only 3 cables exiting the switch. I presume main starter cable, cranking battery and house battery. Are there no house loads?I think you may have helped me. I just spoke with West Marine and was told that my wire coming off the ACR LED is not supposed to go to my switch. That is causing the ACR to ground out. It's supposed to go to a light indicator on my dash...

Will be getting my circuit breaker tomorrow morning and try this all out then..

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[SeattleBoat]

No dice.. video link below of me trying to start it.

Replaced the 50 amp circuit. Connected back to stock, power and ground off engine straight to a charged battery (was charged to 100% on my charger before starting). Have the new Mando alternator installed correctly w/ the exciter wire, ground and power. But it wont turn.

Looks and feels like a bad battery.. this is my 3rd battery I've had lying around that was charged. Could this be a starter possibly? I don't have knowledge on checking voltage across everything.. but that is what i should learn to do asap.

EDIT: I did get it to turn much more than that when I pulled my truck battery out for a quick test. So I know the engine isn't siezed thank the lord.. but it did have me worried. This vid below shows on the boat battery..

Any thoughts? Vid below :confused:

https://youtu.be/jLBHOjhQmh0

[SeattleBoat]

There is only 1 way to learn and its by doing. Wish I never attempted the dual battery.. summer is running away from me :mad: Appreciate all the tips you guys have given

I removed the starter and did a bench test w/ battery and it spins.., it seems to slightly move around a bit right at the end. Not really sure what to think. Off video, I attached power to just the solenoid and it operated fine, pushing the gear out. There seems to be a little play, so I think I'll place an order w/ skidim for part# RA12209. I saw others have used DB Electrical for starters.. but the ones I'm finding both seem unavailable to order. At this point.. I don't want to get too creative. Just want a solution.

Heres a vid of the bench test..

https://youtu.be/msc9k6t7ueQ

Guys have any thoughts on that?

[Wylietunes]

No dice.. video link below of me trying to start it.

Replaced the 50 amp circuit. Connected back to stock, power and ground off engine straight to a charged battery (was charged to 100% on my charger before starting). Have the new Mando alternator installed correctly w/ the exciter wire, ground and power. But it wont turn.

Looks and feels like a bad battery.. this is my 3rd battery I've had lying around that was charged. Could this be a starter possibly? I don't have knowledge on checking voltage across everything.. but that is what i should learn to do asap.

EDIT: I did get it to turn much more than that when I pulled my truck battery out for a quick test. So I know the engine isn't siezed thank the lord.. but it did have me worried. This vid below shows on the boat battery..

Any thoughts? Vid below :confused:

https://youtu.be/jLBHOjhQmh0

This vid indicates the starter system is electrically working as you see the engine bump.

[SeattleBoat]

This vid indicates the starter system is electrically working as you see the engine bump.I agree... But when I did that a few other times the starter gear would kick out but then come back in. It fluctuated a bit, so I'm a bit confused as well.

I did order a starter from Skidim.. will know Thursday..



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[Wylietunes]

Been awhile since ive bench tested a starter, but it sure does look like it spins up slow. Could just be a total coincidence that the starter craps out at the same time you are testing the new dual bank setup.

With that said, yeah, if you want the LED output direct to the battery, no telling what it would cause the ACR to do, so blowing that 80A fuse is possible.

Honestly, I never use the LED or the SI terminals on single engine trailer boats. All you need is the ground control.

[SeattleBoat]

Installed the starter and i have zero power anywhere, battery is fully charged. When my neighbor was here jumping the motor by hand on the old starter, he obviously tripped something.. but I don't know what? I checked the continuity of the thermal fuses in the pics below.. they are good. Could this be an ignition module that needs replacing? If that was dead.. would the whole boat be dead as well?

The 50 amp circuit breaker at the engine is good..

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210912/2f82d919deed4a7ce9ce5eed48fcc45a.jpg

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[Wylietunes]

Installed the starter and i have zero power anywhere,

So you went from the old starter trying to turn the engine over to the new starter doing nothing?

Need to elaborate on the "zero power anywhere". Voltage at the starter's main battery cable post? Voltage at the yellow/red solenoid wire when the key is n the crank position?

[SeattleBoat]

Didn't connect the main power from battery to the new starter today. Just connected the smaller guage power wire to the starter.. the 4 guage was lying under the engine. What an idiot... FML

Power has been returned. I quit. Who wants to buy a boat! [emoji1787]

At this point, I'm nervous to throw the dual battery setup back in but here we go!

BTW, I appreciate all your help Wylietunes

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