Just started my search for a ski boat

[Cobra Jet]

Hi, I am a new member and I have just started my search for a ski boat. I am looking for a 20 to 22 foot open bow. I would like to spend under $10,000, so I think I will be looking for something in the early to mid 1990’s. Any advice of suggestions would be appreciated. I have looked at a 1991 Supra Mariah and a 1991 Ski Centurion.
Thanks
Mark (California)

[DKJBama92Mariah]

Hello Mark and Welcome!

In that vintage, Supras came in three lengths 19, 21, and 23.In a 21 foot bowrider you'll be looking for a Mariah or a Sun Sport. The difference between the two is that the freeboard (the height of the side of the boat) is much greater on the Sun Sport than the Mariah.

Sun Sport
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v55/dkjpika/Boat/f_boat_desc--1625_40.jpg

Mariah
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v55/dkjpika/Boat/DSC00985.jpg

See the difference?

This only really matters if you're planning to board behind it and want to add A LOT of weight. I wouldn't be comfortable putting more than 1,200lbs or so in my Mariah. EVen then you run the risk of taking a large roller over the bow and swamping the boat. Because of its higher freeboard, the Sun Sport is MUCH better suited for wakeboarding with a lot of ballast. On the other hand, because the Mariah is lighter, it will have a slightly better/smaller wake at slalom speeds. So that choice really depends an what you want to do with it.

The Mariah is definitely not a big lake boat. The low freeboard makes it downright scary in any swells over 1.5-2 feet. If you'll be boating in rough water ofter, get the boat with the most freeboard you can get.

You also might look at a 23 foot saltare. Its also a little wider, and a bit roomier. The big thing is there is much more room around the motor box making it easier to move around when you have a bunch of folks on board. You can also put a lot more ballast weight in it for wakeboarding if thats your thing.

In the 1992-93 model years Supra made some changes that you should consider. First, starting in 92, Supra began transitioning its lineup from wood stringers encased in fiberglass to all-fiberglass construction below the water line, stringers included. The wood-stringer boats can be subject to floor and stringer rot, really bad news. Its not a deal-breaker though, you just have to be careful to check the stringers and floors for rot before you buy. Some models in 92 had wood and some had glass, you just have to check. I know my 92 Mariah is all glass. I'm almost certain all models went all-glass in 93.

They also changed the windshields and dashboards in 92-93. The old windsheild and dash are like the 91 model you looked at. The windshield has flat panes and the frame is stout and troublefree to my knowledge. The new windshield was curved and is known to have issues now and then. I have heard of the glass deglazing and fogging up on the inside, but I've never actually seen it. The other issue is the hinged walkthrough part of it. Some of these just plain didnt work. Either the rubber hinge breaks or the driverside part doesn't catch the center window and it just swings down into the walkthrough. Mine did both and i just gave up and put it the closet. Been running without it for 10 years.I call the new 92-93 style dash the monstrosity b/c I can't see over it without sitting on 2 throwable PFDs. The radio is at the top left; It's really not bad looking though. The curved plastic switchpanels will crack eventually, but its not hard to fix that.

OK thats the rundown on the models and issues in those years. Correct me if I'm wrong but I would think that an american skier of that vintage would have a pretty low freeboard. A poor choice if you plan on serious boarding with serious weight, but not bad if you would rather waterski. Mastercraft and Correctcraft had some fine offerings in that size as well but they will demand a slight price premium. Again, if you want to wakeboard seriously, high freeboard is what you should look for regardless of brand; for skiing and general use it really doesn't matter either way.

The good news is there couldn't be a better time to buy. People are literally and figuratively giving boats away. You might can stretch your dollar further than you think and get into a newer model. It's 4 months til spring, take your time. Maybe look at some $15k boats and throw out a lowball offer and see if you get a bite.

Good luck and keep us posted on your search.

DKJ

[cowboy4]

My pirata throws out a decent wake with just a few friends. Haven't weighted it down yet but can attest that it does fairly well in rough water for a comp boat. I would be very confident putting quite a bit of weight in it and stay in rough water. If you get a pirata/saltare get a big block. Make sure andcheck the stringers.... Trust me it's not a fun mistake to make.

[Cobra Jet]

Thanks for all the advice. I have only owned one other boat and that was about 20 years ago.
What things should I be careful to look for?
What is the best way to tell if the boat has rot in the stringers?

[DKJBama92Mariah]

Thanks for all the advice. I have only owned one other boat and that was about 20 years ago.
What things should I be careful to look for?
Stringer rot and soft/mushy floors; Salty can speak to this better than I can.

Yank the ski pylon back and forth to make sure it is still mounted solidly.

Watch out for a fish called Wanda in the bilge.

Look out for rust stains on the exhaust manifolds from water seeping out of the joint between the manifold and riser. If they're leaking on the outside, they're probably leaking on the inside as well; the water from an inside leak runs right down through the exhaust valves and into the cylinders. A new set of manifolds and risers will run you about $750 + shipping; something to keep in mind.

Assuming the engine starts and runs, you then need to run a compression test on the engine. More important than the actual pressure is the consistency between the cylinders. You want them to be within 10-15% of each other with the average being over 100-105 psi.

NOTE: The proper way to check compression is with the engine warm, all spark plugs out, with the throttle set wide-open. Remove the positive wire to the coil to deactivate the ignition or just ground the coil output wire to the block. Then just screw the compression tester into the spark plug hole. Crank the engine at least 10 full revolutions and record the high reading on the gauge. Reset the gauge and repeat for all 8 cylinders recording each high reading.

Looking from the front of the engine the cylinders are numbered like this:
The distributor location is marked with a "D"

FORD CHEVY 350
4 8 8 D 7
3 7 6 5
2 6 4 3
1 D 5 2 1

and I'm pretty sure the Chevy 454 has same numbering scheme as the 350. What say you Salty?

You don't absolutely have to do the test with the engine warm, but a cold engine, particularly one that hasn't run in quite a while, will sometimes have bad readings cold, and perfect ones once the engine has been run. Basically, you can do the test cold if its more convenient, just don't walk away from a boat b/c of bad cold readings. If you get the poor results, repeat the test warm before walking.

While you've got the motor running, check around the connections of the big exhaust hoses that run from the risers to the floor for seeping water. This hose isn't exactly cheap and is a royal PITA to work with. This oftern goes hand in hand with the rusty manifolds and risers. Not a dealbreaker, just a potential expense to consider.

Take a look at the oil on the dipstick. Is the oil milky?

Look at the wiring harness on the engine and behind the dash. Is it hacked to hell and back? See the quote in my sig for details on this.
Moving on...

Check for critters underneath the bow playpen seats;

Check the overall condition of the vinyl. Are the seems splitting?

Check all the electrical safety gear:
Blowers;
Bilge pump;
Built in cooler:
Horn...rarely works, but that's fine; good excuse to get a cool 18" chrome foghorn.
Lights: two, sometimes three of them. Front green and red nav, masthead, and sometimes a white stern light.

Turn the steering all the way left and right. Does it operate freely without binding? Check the full travel of the throttle for binding as well.

Do the gauges work?

Well, that should cover most of the inside of the boat. Hopefully others will speak up and fill in the blanks that I've missed.

You can reasonably do all of these checks on your first visit to the prospective boat, except for the warm compression test in cases where water is unavailable.

We still need to cover the hull, running gear, and trailer but I'll save that for a future post.

Once you find one you like, then you really should insist on a "sea trial"
(test drive) before buying. It's going to suck ass in wintertime, but I find it hard to justify spending $10k on a boat without actually driving it. What to look for on the sea trial is a whole 'nother post in and of itself.

Perhaps another poster would like to speak up and hit these topics...
If I can round up enough material, I might consider trying hash together a used supra buyers guide putting all the info in one place with credit given to the original author of the info. I've seen threads like that all the time on PC hardware forums. That is, if members want to see something like that.



What is the best way to tell if the boat has rot in the stringers?
Bring a set of sockets and a ratchet when you go to look at one. Use the ratchet to crank down on the motor and transmission mount bolts that go into the stringers. If they turn freely and don't seem to ever tighten up, RUN, don't walk away; there plenty of boats out there without stringer issues. Again, Salty can like speak to this much better than I can.

[Salty87]

DKJ covered just alot, you might read thru that a few times.

basically, if you're buying a boat from someone who didn't care enough to take care of things correctly, you're playing with fire. one thing on your side is that supra stopped using wood for stringers sometime in the early 90's. there's a post around here about that, mine's from the 80's so i didn't really pay attention to the answer. no idea on centurion.

both of the boats you mention are slightly geared toward skiing, is that on purpose or just what you've seen?

if i were in your position, i'd go look at alot of boats. get used to looking at, sitting it, riding in different boats to see what you want. look for telltale signs of abuse...stains (who can't clean a stain?...someone who doesn't give a sh!t)....soft spots in floors, mold on carpet under seats....look all over the hull for rusty hardware (should all be stainless steel, nothing should be rusting on the hull), look for signs of silicone sealant (boats often leak, silicone is a dead giveaway of possible problems and an owner who might not have bothered to fix a problem correctly)....the bilge should be clean, the cleaner the better....

the list can go on and on but you should have the idea...if you've ever bought something used that you knew alot about, then you know how to inspect things. a boat needs a serious inspection looking for things that are out of place, repairs done incorrectly, or just lacking care. i'd rather not see rust anywhere and that includes the trailer.

depending on your level of comfort, you can pay to have a boat surveyed. it's not a guarantee that there won't ever be problems but it could help prevent you from buying a project instead of a boat.

lastly, this is a great time to be buying a boat. don't be in a rush...you want a garage-kept boat where the owner has bought a new boat....don't fall for the trap of the boat that hasn't been used in years.

ok 1 more...running the engine in the driveway isn't the same as running the boat. run away from anyone that doesn't want to take you out (or doesn't understand waiting if you're iced over).