Speeding up ballast filling

[Fman]

Anyone have any tricks to increasing the fill time on the ballast sacs on my '08? I know while driving 30+ mph if you hit the fill they will increase, this also helps prime the system. I know the '09s are using an impeller driven system which is supposed to be 300% faster. However I was told by SC it would be a major re-do to implement the new system into my boat. I would also like to know what Mastercraft, Malibu and other boats are using to pump water into there ballast tanks.

So, is there a bigger pump you can purchase to speed up the GPM flow? or any other suggestions to help increase the flow? Have never seen a tsunami pump, but apparently they are pretty quick, dont know if it would be possible to install a bigger, larger pump than is currently on the system.

[87SunSportMikeyD]

What kind of pumps do you have, aerator pumps or reversable/sump pumps?

[jonyb]

I asked this same question on wakeworld, and the best thing to do is throw away the crappy sprinkler valves that come on these boats. Their nothing but problems anyway. 2 of mine have gone bad and I have to completely isolate the water at the inlet valve to keep my bags from filling on their own (and no, there's no trash in them). Someone over there said that kept the OEM pump next to the inlet, then added 3 pumps in teh place of the sprinkler valves. The power wires work the same way, so it sounds like a real easy upgrade.

[Fman]

I asked this same question on wakeworld, and the best thing to do is throw away the crappy sprinkler valves that come on these boats. Their nothing but problems anyway. 2 of mine have gone bad and I have to completely isolate the water at the inlet valve to keep my bags from filling on their own (and no, there's no trash in them). Someone over there said that kept the OEM pump next to the inlet, then added 3 pumps in teh place of the sprinkler valves. The power wires work the same way, so it sounds like a real easy upgrade.

How much more GPM are you going to get by replacing the valves? There still is only one intake port, so basically by replacing the sprinkler valves with 3 pumps they are running 4 total? If you added another intake port under the boat to add more water capabilities I can see this working very well.

Who is someone over there? do you have any pictures of this? If they replaced the valves with pumps, how do stop water from coming into the bags while driving? manual shut-off valve?

This might be my winter project this year. If you had some pictures of this that would be great. I know the '09's have a seperate intake port for each bag, and the pumps are impeller driven which prime easier and push a lot more water. It would be nice if Supra offered an upgrade kit, I asked them about retrofitting to the '09 pumps and they said it would be difficult.

[Fman]

What kind of pumps do you have, aerator pumps or reversable/sump pumps?

Honestly, I could not tell you. I know you can run them dry and they wont be damaged. I dont have access to my boat (I am at work), or I could take a look and tell you.

[jonyb]

The people that responded over there had already discussed this same thing and it worked well for them. The valves just sit there, and open/close when you tell them to (except for mine). Having 3 pumps instead would be MUCH better, because they pump water, unlike the valves. Some people have added an extra intake port, some have'nt. See if you can find my thread over there. i don't really have time at the moment to search for it.

[Fman]

Got in contact with Jason at wakemakers. There are three options to changing the system.

First is JABSCO reversible impeller driven pumps, they also act as a check valve so the bags wont fill up when driving the boat. $240/each x 3 pumps is a little pricey. Jason said fill times will be cut in half with these because of removing the sprinkler valves. You can use this pump to drain and fill, its reversible and has a 10 foot draft capability from 100% priming all the time. Although, little confused on how a 9 GPM pump (540 GPH) can pump 90 gallons of water in 5.5 minutes? This is the easiest conversion, by removing sprinkler valves and replacing with JABSCO pumps, but also the most expensive ($800 with all parts needed). Downfall to these pumps if you run themn dry they will burn up and damage the impeller. He did say you can just use them to fill the bags and leave the current drain pumps on the sacs (aerator style, wont damage running dry). These are the pumps Mastercraft, and the new Supra '09s are using.

Next is the Tsunami 800's (aerator style), replacing the sprinkler valves. Need to grind or replace the current scupper so water will not be forced into the system. Also need the J tube vents to help eliviate bags from filling when driving. Cost is around $300 to do this. They pump 13 GPM, which again still does not add up to a 5.5 min fill time on a 90 gallon bag. Nice thing is on all these systems you will have a seperate pump for each bag.

Last is the Tsunami 1200's, similiar to the 800 setup but a little more involved making them adapt to the 3/4" line/manifold system. Jason said you only increase fill times by about 30 seconds on a 90 gallon bag.

I am getting in contact with him again today to find out about the GPM flow not adding up to the fill times he sent me. Unless these pumps are heavily under-rated.

I will keep you posted....

[Fman]

Just ordered my new setup, I am going with the Tsunami 800's to replace the sprinkler valves. Also ordering 3 vented loops, additional 3/4" hose, and adapor fittings to attach the tsunami's to the supra manifold. I chose to go with the Tsunamis because I wanted a little faster fill time than the JABSCO pump would offer. Also was about $500 less in cost. Jason said they have had good results with the 800's and they have been holding up well to heat and the elements in the vdrive compartment.

Per Jason, I am going to have to remove the scupper from the boat, and grind down the cup that forces water through the system, you dont want this to happen with the tsunami setups. Having the cup will force water into the system while driving the boat. I will be re-routing the front ballast line to come up under the dash to mount the vented loop for the front ballast sac. The rear sac vented loops will be mounted on the backside ski locker, up as high as possible. The vented loops help stop any water from coming into the bags when the system is not being used. The tsunamis are not self priming so the trick is to mount them lower than the water level once the boat is in the water. The Supra has at least a 20" draft for water depth. As long as the tsunamis are lower than the water level they will have no problems creating a prime and pulling water into the sacs. I am going to mount all 3 pumps as close the bottom of the floor in the boat as possible.

I will take pictures of this entire project and post them as I go. I am hoping to have the parts by Monday next week and possibly start this job on Thursday next week. So far all the parts have totaled around $240. Most likely I will need a few misc. fittings from the local hardware store and 3M 3200 marine adhesive for re-sealing the scupper valve. Should be less than $300 to complete this project, which for me will be money well spent. The sprinkler valve setup is not effective and puts a huge restraint on fill times with the friction loss of water traveling through them. Still debating whether to remove the filter system. Jason said when wakemakers does an install they remove it because it adds more restriction flow.

Wakemaker claims with this system I should be able to fill a 2000 lb ballast system in about 5.5 minutes. Currently for me to fill all my bags takes about 12-14 minutes. And eliminating the sprinkler valve system will also be a nice upgrade.