V-Drive to Driveshaft coupling bolts fell out under power...disaster ensues

[klewis]

Just a heads up to anyone with a new boat, make sure you are periodically checking your bolts that attach the drive shaft to the V-drive or transmission. Mine must have been loose and some already fallen out as I was under power when the final one let go. All I know was I powering up onto plane and the most awful metal on metal grinding noise occurred. I dove the boat and found the prop mangled and slightly hung up on the rudder. After being towed in and getting it on the trailer I tried to pull the prop off to see if I could salvage my trip by bending and hammering it back, at this point I thought maybe I had hit something, but what I still didn't know. However the prop wouldn't come off because it was too close to the rudder. Its then that I went up and looked into the engine compartment I found all four bolts laying on the bottom of the boat and the drive shaft separated two inches from the v-drive. Now you know what the grinding was, my prop having slid back into the rudder.

Obviously these bolts must have worked themselves out over time, most likely they weren't even tight from the factory since this is only the second season on my boat and here in WA the seasons are short. It's an out of sight part on the boat so any quick visual inspections I have given the boat whenever I change the oil have missed this, my dealer hadn't caught it either. Apparently you need to put a wrench to crucial items such as this to avoid this. However I feel like if I bought a brand new car I wouldn't expect the drive shaft to fall off this quickly and that the bolts would be torqued properly from the start. Especially on a $65k car.

[87SunSportMikeyD]

That really stinks. What does your dealer say about it? I would email Rick directly at [email protected], and [email protected]

[klewis]

My dealer is in just as much shock as I am as to how all four could fall out without anyone noticing. They said they werent sure how this warranty would go and who the responsibility ultimately falls to. I dont like the way its starting though, but I will give my dealership the chance to handle it with SC first and only escalate it to a higher level if I have to. They said SC is backed up with claims and taking a few weeks just to start looking at them and that they are being sticklers considering the state of things. So we'll see how it goes. My season will be over in a month, so I cant wait around for the warranty to process before I get back on the water. This just happened on Saturday and since I have plans both days this coming weekend I had to front the money to order the prop myself from skidim.com, pay expedited freight, since neither my dealer or SC has any in stock. The dealer said I'll get reimbursed when the warranty goes through.

I'm just at a loss as to how even I didnt see this coming, I consider myself somewhat mechanical, but at the same time my dealer didnt catch it either. The coupling is out of direct sight under and behind the v-drive. The other thing thats weird is that I didnt find any nuts in the bilge area. There is enough gap they could have slid under the gas tank, but one would think that the odds are the nuts would come off while things were spinning and at those RPMs it would be like a bullet flying around in the engine compartment and be a noticeable noise. So with the absence of the nuts in the bilge and never having heard one let go, I wonder if the nuts were ever there. But even that sounds crazy given that the bolts can only go in and up from the drive shaft side, they do stay when you put them back in, but youd think they would have slid out sooner. Although there is a chance it could be physically possible since the turning prop is always pushing that shaft tight against the coupling, only in reverse does it pull back, but the way the driveshaft seal is set up it keeps the drive shaft from going too far unless you put a lot of force on it and when I back my boat up I am never very hard on it. There's always been a clunk when shifting, but since it did it from the start I thought it was normal, now I am wondering....

We'll see. I'll be sure to post as thing progress.

[thescott]

Scary stuff. Sorry to hear about that. When I came up to the 20 hour mark on my 0822ssv, I went to complete the 20 hour service including the engine/v drive alignment (which by the way was WAY out of spec). All four of the coupling bolts on mine were VERY loose and rattling around down there. I wondered at the time how much longer it would have taken for them to all come off and how tragic the result could have been. Following alingment, I snugged them up and now check them frequently - about every other time out on the water. I've put on an additional 120 hours since then and they've never come loose again which leads m to believe they were loose from the factory...but who knows.

Good luck with your claim - hope you get back on the water soon and things go smooth with SC.

[tg0824SSVGG]

HOLY SHNICKES .... di you have any idea what they should be torqued to?

[thescott]

The shaft alignment procedure document I received from skier's choice says 25-30 ft lbs.

[techsledder]

Not that this will help klewis’s case but as a preventative measure I would suggest others using loctite on those bolted connections. I have also used both in my career (engineering) and on my personal equipment (snowmobile) Nord-Lock washers http://www.nordlock.com/ for high vibration connections. They work great! If you have the room to use them I’d go ahead and buy some. I have gotten mine from Fastenal before.

klewis good luck man!

[rludtke]

Both of the described events suggest to me that Skiers Choice has a manufacturing quality problem.

[klewis]

Well I got the boat back today all bolted back together. My dealer turned it around the same day on a Friday and already sent off my prop to get fixed. They took care of the labor and left me with the impression they would take care of the cost to fix the prop. I did pay for a new prop that arrived today right on time just like www.skidim.com said it would, Karen there is great!

I did fork out the money for the new prop because of the situation, but if the dealer pays to fix my prop Im not sure where that leaves me on the cost of the new prop. Its not like I shouldnt have already owned a back up prop anyway with the many trips we do far from a new prop source.

My dealer said everything else looks good, no bent driveshaft or alignment problems. The weather has decided to suck tomorrow, but we'll see if I get the chance Sunday to get out and test it on the water.

My dealer didnt find any nuts in the bilge either and they kind of hinted at the fact that they thought maybe they were never there to being with.

[ngavchris]

Klewis
Glad to here you got you got your boat back. It will be interesting to see if you still have the klunk when shifting. Did it destroy your rudder? I lost my transmission on July 4th about 6 years ago. Took it to the local Mastercraft dealer. They kept it 3 weeks only to say "sorry" we can't work on that PCM tranny. I got a buddy to help and talked to skidim. They provided parts and advise on resolving. Turned out it was not properly aligned and it gradually destroyed the internal housing of the tranny. Lost about 6 weeks of time. Enjoy what is left.

[michael hunter]

Klewis
Sounds to me the new prop and all the labor should be covered by warranty. If you can make a deal on the rebuilt prop I would. The bolts should not have come loose but with no nuts being found this one is SCs problem.

[klewis]

ngavchris- No it didnt destroy the rudder, luckily the prop blades are much thinner! You can tell where the rudder was hit, but it doesnt seem to have damaged it. Ill know tomorrow when I take it out, weather prevented that today.

michael hunter- ya missing nuts is a bit of an issue...we'll see what happens

[lowdrag]

Just a thought but I hope they put new bolts in and saved the ones that worked their way out. Due to the application the bolts are used for and the relatively low torque specs for them I'd guess that the assembly process requires that thread locking compound should be used on them. It's possible that whoever did the assembly overlooked it and that's why they worked themselves loose. If they did use it you should be able to see the red or blue remnants on the thread. If you've still got the bolts it could be a good piece of evidence if there is a dispute over whether or not it's a warranty claim or lack of proper maintenance.

[klewis]

I thought about that too, but did not find any remnants of thread lock on the bolts. They used nylock nuts when they put it back together so my assumption is that is how they do it from the factory. Which would do kind of the same thing. My dealer took some pictures of how everything was after it happened to send off to Supra.

[depsawdawg]

Unbelievable, I just went through the same experience, at Norris Lake, Tn., “THE CLUNK”, and no forward/reverse, same issue, BOLTS LOOSENED AND FELL OUT! I have to thank the Supra Dealership in Knoxville, 1-Hr. repair, and back on the water!!! I know the nylon nuts are the factory spec, on the driveshaft coupling bolts, and no “Locktite” was used. I will be taking the advice, checking the nut and bolt assembly after every outing.

[SupraTamu]

This may be a dumb question but where is this located at so i can double check mine I have an 08 Supra 24'SSV

[klewis]

Pull your back seat cushion out, remove the small cooler that gives you access to the front of the engine comparment. This is where the transmission connects to the v-drive which in turn connects to the drive shaft Look from the right of the compartment(your right) and follow the driveshaft from where it comes through the hull back up where it dissapears under the v-drive. This is where the coupling is that you are looking for.

[JohnnyDL]

Old thread, same problem. Was out on the lake when I felt a clunk and thought the prop had fallen off. Swam underneath and found that the prop was still there, so I loaded up and went home. Further investigation revealed that the only bolt with a nut on it had finally sheared off, found the other 3 bolts in the bilge with no evidence there had ever been nuts on them. At least with mine, I was just beginning to accelerate when it gave out, so no prop damage. Right now I'm just trying to do some research to make sure it didn't mess up the shaft seal.

2009 Supra 24SSV GG

[kennyk69]

I use loctite blue to help with this concern because I too have had all the nylock nuts loosen and fall out. I now check the coupling connection for lose hardware often.

[CJD]

I use loctite blue to help with this concern because I too have had all the nylock nuts loosen and fall out. I now check the coupling connection for lose hardware often.

Not to mention the manual says to check the alignment annually...which evolves removing and re-installing the bolts/nuts. Nylocks are not supposed to be re-used.