Bow Carpet, hose routing, painting plastic vents?

[sybrmike]

For you fellow rebuilders out there...

My Saltare was originally completely carpeted under the playpen, port storage, & along the hull sides back to the helm. 20 years old & coming out for the rebuild. What did you go back with? I'd like to stay away from carpet since it holds moisture (musty, mildew, etc.), but would like to protect the hull a bit from items rolling around in storage. Roll on bed liner? other?

Also, each side intake vent had 2 3" hoses (4 total) routed forward of the ice chest where they entered the floor. Then a poor design of encapsulating the hoses in foam under the floor before exiting into the forwardmost center of the bilge between the inner stringers - water trap. There's got to be a better way, but I can't figure this one out???

Finally, the original "chrome" finish on the plastic side intake vents is pretty worn. I'd like to just lightly sand and paint black. Any suggestions on a good spray paint that will hold up to sun, water, wash, wax, etc? Epoxy? Urethane? Enamel? Base/Clear? Don't want them looking like crap after awhile.

Thanks

[Okie Boarder]

I haven't gotten to that point yet, but my plan is to lay the carpet back like it was.

My vents are run a little different. They go to the side kick panel by the drivers seat and attach with flanges on that. I can take some pictures of that piece to try to show you if it would help.

Not sure on the paint.

[sybrmike]

Thanks Okie,

I went back through your rebuild thread yet again (great reference & continued great work!) and saw that your floor was open under the ice chest. I assume your vents dumped into the bilge in this area somehow? Yes, additional pics would be helpful. My floor is solid (well, actually kinda mushy) & covers everything forward of the engine. Since I'm already making changes in this area (adding a removable floor section between the inner stringers, from forward of the engine to the ice chest), looking for ways to further improve the floor/bulkhead/ducting in that area. I need new vent collectors anyway, so thinking of single 4"ers to simplify things.

I'm still on the fence about carpeting underneath. Moisture is the excuse I'm using to consider alternatives. Probably not really an issue since it's still the standard route on today's boats. Truthfully, probably more to do with concern for my abilities and the skill required to carpet those areas - lots of angles, curves, seams (floors & seat bases are easy). Definetely done before the cap goes back on.

Thanks again & continued success on your progress.

[Oilguy]

I share your concern about carpet under the playpen... I was looking into other things as well and I think I am going to paint it. Maybe some fleck paint like you see in old car trucks or what you can get for epoxy garage floor paints now. I want something bright and easy to clean that doesn't absorb water.

For the vents... I put the holes in the same place but I used 6" Styrofoam board under there and used a long drill bit to cut a vent hole to the bottom >> I left a 4"-6" gap in the bottom for the air to flow to the rear... I also filled in the front "V" area and glassed it over so that it didn't collect water like it did.

[jet]

oilguy..where are your 51% rebuild pic's????? Don't make me pull this boat over..

[Okie Boarder]

sybr,

I'll see what pics I can come up with. Did you notice the way I'm going to layout the floor in my thread? It will remain open under the cooler, like it was.

Here's the way the vents work (in case I can't find pictures). Picture looking under the helm where your left leg would be. There is a panel there that is kind of a kick panel that goes from the floor to knee height. On the top there are two 3" flanges. The flexible vent hoses attach to those and go up and over the streering cable to the starboard side vent right be the windshield. It basically lets air go directly into the bilge just beside that open area under the cooler.

This picture shows that area without the panel in place.


http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu144/OkieBoarder/Stringer%20Pics%20092209/IMG_6750.jpg

[sybrmike]

Thanks,

Ahh, the subtle differences between the Salt and Sun (even though ours are the same year). I have a small hole in the floor in the same area for the wiring to pass - kinda splits the seam between the kick board/floor/inner stringer. Not big enough for a duct - but may be able to open it up under the front of the ice chest. I'll keep thinkin' on this one...

The port side is a little more problematic for me. All of the space to route ducting is up under the glove box/side storage area. I'm hoping to shove a 400# sack back under this area from the bow. Makes routing the hose challenging & then need to protect from crushing by the sac?

May just have to go the same routing path for both (dump in play pen area forward of ice chest & just modify the transition into the bilge so it doesn't hold water. Oil, Sound like a good idea filling in the vee. From the description, sure I can come up with something similar to your solution.

Thanks again.

[Okie Boarder]

Interesting. The port side is kind of a funny one. I found out when I pulled my top cap that my hoses just kind of dangle in there basically in the gunwale area. Look back at the pictures in my thread of the front view of the cap missing. I had a floor in the port side storage and dead space under it. My thought is they kind of laid in there. I'm planning to open that area up too, cutting the floor out and the wall between the spotter seat storage and the under dash storage. When I do that I may discover those hoses sitting there. If that's the case, I'm probably just going to route them along the front of that compartment over to the bilge.

You could definitely reroute them somehow, through there, or use some hard PVC so they can't be crushed.

[Salty87]

i pretty much used the original design with the exception of all the foam. i still have the 4 hoses going into the floor in front of the ice chest. it's a pain to get those right...you can't cut the holes with the top in place. have to cut them first and hope you hit the target really close.

i skipped routing the hoses through the bottom of the bilge and through foam, what a mess. my hoses end at the floor, the underside is open so air can flow through the bilge channel. if rain or an water gets into the vents and through the hoses, it will drain out via the pump.

i left the vents chromed to match the rails. you might be better off getting them powder coated than painted. i'd probably use rustoleum if i were painting them.

[mapleleaf]

I've had some success with rustoleum's plastic paint, created for outdoor furniture...... a good sanding and priming and my grill inserts on my truck didn't need redoing for 3 years.....snow, salt, sleet, stone chips and rain!!!!!!
Mind you I did have to repaint them.......

[sybrmike]

Thanks for the tips.

Salty
Did you put a bulkhead between the inner stringers farther forward or lower than original in this area? Any more details here?
Yeah - shiny would be nice & help tie the front & rear rails together, but the finish is pretty worn. Just struggling to shell out $27 each for new pieces of chromed plastic. I've seen some older Supras with black vents that looked good & might still work well with my black tower. Since they're plastic - don't think I can powdercoat.

Maple
What primer & did you clear coat with anything?

Okie
Obvious now, but hadn't considered hard PVC. Definetely an option - Thanks. Is this the area you're considering for ballast pump?

[Okie Boarder]

sybr,

Kind of. The pump is probably just going to mount on one of the walls under the spotters seat. The area you're talking about will probably be where I mount my amps and battery set up. Opening up the passage from the spotter seat and the floor of the storage is mainly just to utilize the space instead of it being empty.

[Kip]

I can second the plastic paint recommendation. We have used Fusion in quite a few different applications and it has always held up well. Just sand it no primer no clear.

[Salty87]

Salty
Did you put a bulkhead between the inner stringers farther forward or lower than original in this area? Any more details here?


yes. the original design made no sense. i re-arranged the bulkhead in the forward part of the bilge. i made it about 4" shorter than the stringers. this leaves a gap for air to move.

this is original (duh, like you can't tell)
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a10/salty87/IMG_0290.jpg

the foam block under the ice chest is baffling to me as is the routing of hoses through foam.

this is the best pic i can find of the modification
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a10/salty87/IMG_0469.jpg

you can see that the bulkhead no longer reaches the top of the stringer. i essentially made a shelf that allows air to reach the hoses. the shelf directs any water that might get down the hoses into the bilge. the shelf also prevents water from leaving the bilge channel. the forward-most wall of the shelf is the same height as the stringers and completes the bulkhead. that's where cutting the holes gets tricky, you don't want to end up on the wrong side of the bulkhead but with no reference points, that get's hard to determine.

[Okie Boarder]

That is a pretty wierd design. Some of the old CC's are kind of like that too. They buried hose in foam. I like the way Salty did his for the Saltare, since it is a bit different. The idea of just using hard PVC would work too. Figure out where you'd really rather have the hoses and go that route. I'm leaving that whole forward area open in mine, like jason and jester did. You might consider that, as well. (Could be a good place to stash a ballast bag)

Salty,

How much of the urethane foam did you end up using for your rebuild?

I'm actually starting to finalize a few things, making sure I have enough biaxial, resin, CPES to finish. Also thinking about ordering the foam before too much longer, along with getting my carpet and glue.

[Salty87]

i used either 2 or 3 of the 2lb kits from uscomposites....i'd have to check my receipts. i'm thinking it was 3 but temp is a very big variable. foam poured in the late afternoon shade expanded to about 60% of the size compared to foam poured in the direct sunlight/heat.

on a saltare, there aren't too many options for routing the hoses. you have to end up in the middle bilge valley, anywhere behind the ice chest is occupied or exposed so that only leaves the area in the bow under the seats. you could route some hoses or pvc to a more solid 'manifold' in the bow storage area and create an opening in the floor. that might prevent bags from collapsing the hoses.

[sybrmike]

Thanks guys - that helps alot!

I can't leave the floor open under the ice chest. My 89 has angle brackets that support the walk-thru area of the cap from the floor under the ice chest. The original floor is really soft here & has settled - no wonder the center windshield wasn't closing well. Think I'll move the front bulhead farther forward and decrease the angle to the hull to make sure the space under the floor 6-8" forward of the ice chest is open to the bilge. That'll give me some slop room when routing the duct (thanks for the head's up - I'll be sure to take some reference dimensions before I pop the cap).

I'll have a single run of 4" pvc from each side & use a short section of flex to attach to the collector up out of harm's way from any sacs/stored items (Jim @ Viper says he commonly uses pvc ducting).

I'll give the rattle-can for plastic a try on the vents before I ante up for new ones.

Humidity also plays a big part on 2 part foam expansion - drier is better.

[Okie Boarder]

Salty,

Maybe you can do me a favor and look at your receipts.

They have the 2lb density foam, which is what is used in boats in the following...

4lb kit - 2 cu ft
16lb kit - 8 cu ft
80lb kit - 40 cu ft

sybr,

I don't mean to hijack your thread here, but it seemed like a good place to ask the question.

[Salty87]

it says 3 kits of the 2lb urethane foam, 16 lb kit. (foam-0216)

i don't think i had much leftover if any.

[Okie Boarder]

OK, that makes sense...about 24 cu ft. I'm going to try to take some measurements and do calculations too, but that gives me a great reference. Thanks!

[sybrmike]

No probs Okie - jump in anytime.

[88MariahATX]

Here is the link to the place where I bought my epoxy and my 2 part foam from. They were very helpful in making sure i got what I need. They also have listed the square footage the foam should cover.

http://www.jgreer.com/boat-foam.htm