Pulley Problems

[csuggs]

My alternator belt is about half as wide as it should be and there is belt dust all over the front of the motor. I believe the culprit is the rough surfaces on both the crankshaft and water pump (Ford) pulleys. I removed them and cleaned with a wire wheel on the bench grinder, but they are still pitted and not smooth. I'm wondering if anyone has gone to aluminum pulleys. If so where did you get them? I have the Ford part numbers for cross-reference. Also I wonder if a machine shop could duplicate the pulleys . . .
Anybody out there had to deal with this? What was your fix?

[cadunkle]

Check Summit. You'll spend money there as you won't find plane jane steel pullies. Important things are 3 or 4 bolt dampener, pulley diameter and number of grooves. It's possible there are different depths of pullies which could mess with belt alignment. So check backspacing. I believe most cars/trucks ar ehte same as most small block Fords had a normal low mount alternator, except a few oddball ones like Pinto/Mustang II and some of the high mount large case alternators. Since the marine alternator is mounted on goofy side the bracketry is different and depth may be different.

Check ebay for pullies, you might find a set from a small block car. You could also try some local junkyards... Look for 60s-80s small block Fords. Earlier is better as you'll be more likely to find a 2 groove crank pulley. Sandblast/wire wheel and some fresh paint and your golden.

Unfortunately I've scrapped most of my spare parts that I wouldn't use. In the past year or two I've scrapped a few complete small block Fords and countless accessory brackets, pullies, intakes, heads, etc. Shame because I know I had some pullies.

Also, I just thought to check Skidim... They hav some crank pullies though they are obscenely expensive. http://www.skidim.com/products.asp?dept=1125

I can say with 99% certainty the alternator pulley is just a normal Ford 40-65 amp small case alternator single groove pulley. That one should be cake to find anywhere for a couple bucks at most.

[csuggs]

Hey thanks. Yeah, I know skidim has what I need but they are expensive. The crankshaft pulley is 3-bolt and is a Ford part from '69. The water pump pulley is a Ford part from '72. I've looked at March pulleys from Summit and also found CVF Racing pulleys on eBay that are much cheaper than the March ones. I'm checking diameters.
I wire wheeled the grooves of the pulleys I have, but there are still "pits" that could cause issues even after coating. So the search continues . . . .

[sybrmike]

My pulleys were rusted, but only slightly pitted. A good sandblast and powder coat has em looking like new. Powder coat goes on thicker than paint so might be enough for yours? But billet aluminum would be cool...

[jet]

Same prob here, but mine is caused from the V-shaped pully (no pits). I have to tighten it up every spring because the v-shape just grinds it down untill Its loose and spits all of that black dust over the engine. I try and change every 2-years because It starts to get small and weak looking. Remember the constant high rpm's dont help either.

[87SunSportMikeyD]

Yeah mine do the same thing as yours Clint. I go through a couple a season. I got belts with a warranty now hehehe! I was recommended to sandblast and repaint mine too. Let us know what you do.

[csuggs]

Ok Mikey - I'll let you know what I come up with. The billet aluminum pulleys I've found thus far are slightly smaller and will "underdrive" my accessories and I'm not sure if that's a good idea. The crankshaft pulley is about 12% smaller on the aluminum pulley so I would be pumping 12% less water to my motor . . . so I may end up having my existing pulleys coated or try to buy new stock pulleys.
While I have things apart I decided to clean and paint the motor - so here are a couple of pics. Not very good resolution as I took them with my phone.

http://i887.photobucket.com/albums/ac71/csuggs/motor1.jpg

http://i887.photobucket.com/albums/ac71/csuggs/motor2.jpg

[jet]

Those look like flat-head vavle covers. lol


csuggs. I thought your boat was all finished and done??

[jasonba1]

looks great clint

[beast 496]

I have found original PCM belts last much longer than aftermarket, such as Napa. If the belt is slipping, it is not tight enough. Al

[csuggs]

Thanks Jason.

Jet - the boat was completely finished last year, that is everything except the engine and trans. The rest is new or refurbished. I took the motor out in the fall to do some "tinkering". In retrospect I should have brought the motor back home with me last winter while the boat was being rebuilt in Knoxville.

Al - I am using PCM belts. I thought the belts were slipping and kept checking the tension, but soon found that the sides were actually wearing down from the rough pulleys. My alternator belt is worn to 3/8" from 1/2". It finally "bottomed-out" in the sheave from being to narrow!

[beast 496]

Are you in a salt water environment? I just don't understand why the pullys are so rusted or pitted. I just have never seen this. Al

[csuggs]

Al - I think you're right that it's a little unusual to have this problem. I'm not in a saltwater environment. Sometime after I bought the boat I noticed a waterline stain on the oil pan that was even with the floor line of the boat. Knowing that the cover that came with the boat had holes in it and knowing that it had been sitting for many years just before I bought it, I think what happened is that it sat outside with the plug in and with holes in the cover, so rain water caused a portion of the crank pulley to rust. The rusted section of the pulley would correspond with that water stain on the pan. At least that's my theory.
The motor looks real good inside so I don't think water got in the motor.
Clint

[sybrmike]

Good luck finding a pulley solution. In case you don't already - once you've got pulleys that look as nice as the engine does now, prop open the dog house a few inches when you store it. That'll allow some air circulation under there & cut down on condensation and rust on the engine.

[jet]

If you look at most boat engines you will see a ton of surface rust. This is caused by running the motor for hours and then parking it. The temps are high and so is the humidity. This will rust the crap out of the engine. What I do to keep my engine pretty is this. After pulling the boat out of the water I pull it aside, open the engine cover, drain my exhaust and leave it open for as long as Iam wiping and cleaning the boat hull down,20-mins or so. I also open it once I get home to cool it off the rest of the way. This allows most of the heat and humidity to exit and wont sit there for the next 10 hrs rusting my engine. You got to get the heat out, otherwise it will rust everything. Jet

[csuggs]

Yep you guys are right. I've noticed that the engine cover retains A LOT of heat even hours after use. I keep an adjustable aluminum prop rod in the boat just to prop the cover open while I'm cleaning. I also flip all the cushions up on edge after use to allow them to dry and for air to flow through the hull. If I've had a day where we've got the carpet especially wet, I even leave a couple of fans run overnight with everything opened up. I've been thinking of installing a couple of ceiling fans in the garage over where the boat is parked . . .

[csuggs]

Just talked with our local parts coating guy and he has a minimum set-up of $150. I also called the local Ford dealer and the he says the crankshaft pulley is no longer available from Ford. A new crankshaft pulley from skidim is $147 and is made from aluminum (I guess because they can't get them from Ford either). So that takes me back to considering my option of an aluminum set of 3 pulleys I can buy from CVF for $142. Here's a link:

http://www.cvfracing.com/ford-pulley-kits/ford-small-block-pulleys/3-bolt/289-pulley-kit-ps

Here's my question:
Stock crank pulley is 6.125" diameter; CVF replacement is 5.4" diameter
Stock water pulley is 6.4375" dia; CVF replacement is 6.2" dia

I'm not so much worried about the Ford water pump, or the alternator, but will my raw water pump turning at only 88% give me issues???

[jet]

Ccuggs you dont need to recycle the warm moisture soaked air with ceiling fans you need to suck out the warm air and replace it with new cool air, you need one of these. No laughing!! This was one of my 1st cuts with no editing. lol. The boat part is 2-mins into the video.

keep your boat nice and dry:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RlRV1PkaGs

[jet]

Ah. heres a old video of my wife doin her thing. lol. Ah..summer fun. I cant wait for it to return.:mrgreen:


my wife:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1Xq1SbfKoQ

[csuggs]

good idea on the exhaust fans - however my garage has no ceiling and I do have a large cupola that lets the hot air out as long as I crack a window or two. Besides, it probably is not as hot here as it gets in Dallas. :D

Hopefully I'll have an answer from the folks at March Performance on the pullleys before long . . .

[TitanTn]

Csuggs - I may have missed this, but can't you smooth out the pulley you have? Is it just that far gone?

[rludtke]

I don't think it is the rough surface of the pulleys as much as it might be an incorrect alignment of the pulleys. Is one side (forward or aft) of the belt showing wear? Is belt dust getting on the engine? Your pulleys may be out of plane with each other. If one pulley is farther forward or aft of the others, it will cause greater wear on the forward or aft side of the belt, near the top. My boat is doing this very slightly, so I am monitoring it. V belts do not wear on the bottoms, they are supposed to wear on the sides, about half way down the belt surface. If out of alignment, the belt gets the very top worn down, causing dust. Unless extremely severe, this doesn't weaken the belt. Pulleys can be shimmed into alignment.

[csuggs]

Alignment is not the issue - that was my first thought and I checked all that out first. I actually shimmed the alternator bracket slightly to make an improvement, but I still have the belt wearing problem. I should have taken a picture of the pulley prior to wire-wheeling so you guys could see. I've got all the roughness out of the groove now, but there are pits left. That may be good enough to keep the sides of the belt from wearing down so much. I know a v-belt runs in the sides of the groove, but the alternator belt had worn down so much that it had bottomed-out in the sheave.