Calling all cars, calling all cars....all boaters report in

[haugy]

Alright guys. I normally like to keep my projects under wraps until it's done as I don't like the pressure of feeling I need to meet a deadline. I do it, get it done, and bam you see the results.

But......I need the power of you guys.

I need a V-drive that will fit a 454. I'm sure many of you know what that means. But that's what I need help with. Model #s, parts required, etc. Anything you think would be valuable information on mating a 454 to a V-drive transmission.

So chime in if you know some of this already. Chime in if you know where to find them.

Thanks guys.

[wotan2525]

Shutup. You're v-driving the saltare?!

[Salty87]

droooooool

[jsandy]

believe it when i see it. Thats the kind of negative reinforcement that should force you to post pics to prove me wrong.

[haugy]

Yep, that's the plan. I've got a solid layout design in my head, I don't use paper. :D

But I've got some baseline numbers, and structural designs that if I'm right will actually make this a feasible project. But we all know how that works out. The big kicker will be the drive unit. I have to get a V-drive and spec it out before anything else can happen. Until I have that I can't make a step.

That's why I need everyone's search help. I need to find a V-drive for this thing. Until then this project can't start. After that, it's all structural rebuilding like many of you have done before. Stringers, mounts, floor, interior. The only difference is I will have a different spot for the dividing wall, and make new seats.

The biggest hiccup so far is the fact that I can't go as low as I'd like with the block because of the steering assembly in the back. That's could actually stop this project before it starts. If I can't clearance it, I'm screwed.


I've heard good and bad about Walters. Does anyone have any input? I'm also looking at ZF v-drives. Anyone?

This is the Walters version
EDIT: PIC TOO BIG

[SuperSaltAir]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BORG-WARNER-WALTERS-VDRIVE-TRANSMISSION-RATIO-2-0-x-1-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem35b3c0828dQQitemZ23064 9004685QQptZBoatQ5fPartsQ5fAccessoriesQ5fGear#ht_8 26wt_905

This should bolt up right to what you have. But the V drive is the wrong ratio its a 2-1 it needs to be 1.21-1.

[SuperSaltAir]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Walters-v-drive-transmission-RV-260-Malibu-ski-boat-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem2565eaf7deQQitemZ16062 3687646QQptZBoatQ5fPartsQ5fAccessoriesQ5fGear#ht_5 00wt_926

This one needs an adapter to the transmission you have. By the way the shop selling it is a local shop to me and they are top noch shop in my opinion

[haugy]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Walters-v-drive-transmission-RV-260-Malibu-ski-boat-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem2565eaf7deQQitemZ16062 3687646QQptZBoatQ5fPartsQ5fAccessoriesQ5fGear#ht_5 00wt_926

This one needs an adapter to the transmission you have. By the way the shop selling it is a local shop to me and they are top noch shop in my opinion

Thanks on the links. I saw both of those, and wondered about the Malibu one. How do you know it needs an adapter? I'm not doubting you, I need to learn how to pick that out as well. Plus it helps me know if I can make an adapter out of billet aluminum, and change out the output shaft.

[jet]

Thats what I like to hear, someone thats not scared. I have seen a thread done on this before so it can be done. Go for it! Im not afraid to cut mine up. Jet

[dshaff24]

Whats cool is a saltare is a big boat to you would have the cool seating of a new boat with the old styling.. I hope it works out for ya.. Definitly would be a sweet 1 off boat!

[sybrmike]

Sounds like a great adventure. Don't let this die on the vine due to steering clearance - just ditch the pan and dry sump that big block. Sure, it's expensive - but this ain't gonna be a cheap endeavor anyway.

[haugy]

Thats what I like to hear, someone thats not scared. I have seen a thread done on this before so it can be done. Go for it! Im not afraid to cut mine up. Jet

Yep, it's just fiberglass. :D


Whats cool is a saltare is a big boat to you would have the cool seating of a new boat with the old styling.. I hope it works out for ya.. Definitly would be a sweet 1 off boat!

That's why I've been gunning for a Saltare.


Sounds like a great adventure. Don't let this die on the vine due to steering clearance - just ditch the pan and dry sump that big block. Sure, it's expensive - but this ain't gonna be a cheap endeavor anyway.

I don't quit easy, and I'm already considering that. I'm doing some measuring for exact specs this weekend.

But it's all for nothing if I can't figure out this V-drive confusion. That's one thing I know absolutely ZERO about.

[Patrick56]

A V-Drive is just a gear box haugy. Don't be scared of it. You need to find one that will handle the horsepower and torque created by a big-block. The gear ratio can be tweaked with the pitch of the prop (to some extent).

You should try the Walter Machine Company. (201)656-5654. They have made the v-drives a lot longer than people have been putting theme in wake/ski boats. The guy I talked to in their tech department was very helpful. They can probably help with the power requirements and the adapters.

I am pretty sure there several cruisers out there with 454s/496s running through v-drives.

Good luck!

[rludtke]

Would it be wrong to place the engine forward of the steering? While this would eat up some seating capacity, it would enable maintenance access to the stearing, provide space for other accesories such as batteries, and provide equipment storage space directly above the stearing components and accesible to the users at the very rear of the boat.

[haugy]

A V-Drive is just a gear box haugy. Don't be scared of it. You need to find one that will handle the horsepower and torque created by a big-block. The gear ratio can be tweaked with the pitch of the prop (to some extent).

You should try the Walter Machine Company. (201)656-5654. They have made the v-drives a lot longer than people have been putting theme in wake/ski boats. The guy I talked to in their tech department was very helpful. They can probably help with the power requirements and the adapters.

I am pretty sure there several cruisers out there with 454s/496s running through v-drives.

Good luck!

Yeah, the kicker is getting the right ratio, rotation, downward angle, width, spline count, etc. So there is a lot to cover with them. And yeah, Walter and ZF are on my call list. Thanks.


Would it be wrong to place the engine forward of the steering? While this would eat up some seating capacity, it would enable maintenance access to the stearing, provide space for other accesories such as batteries, and provide equipment storage space directly above the stearing components and accesible to the users at the very rear of the boat.

I'm trying to see how it's going to lay out. If it's far enough back, yes that's the plan. To have the engine pulleys above the rudder assembly so I can work on either with room. But if it's more forward than that, I'll have do as recommended with a remote oil resevoir and a low profile oil pan.

Alot of this is going to be fly by wire guessing and modifying as I go. I plan to try and start in the fall if funds allow.

[SuperSaltAir]

Haougy I don't know for sure that it needs an adapter but I have had a saltair and I know what the trany on that looks like and I have the same v drive in my malibu now and I just had it out and I know what that looks like too. Just by looking at those I don't think they will match up. I would take the advice and call the wallter co I talked to them when I was refreshing my v drive and they seem very knowledgeable. Also keep in mind that the front of your engine which will now be facing the back of the boat needs to be angled backwards so the oil will be going to the back of the oil pan when you are trying to come up on plane, this should give you the room you need for your steering to clear. I should be taking my malibu apart in the next few days to do some troubleshooting if you would like I can take pics for you and we can also put measurements on the pics. I only have a small block in that boat but the dimensions are very close.

[rludtke]

... Also keep in mind that the front of your engine which will now be facing the back of the boat needs to be angled backwards so the oil will be going to the back of the oil pan when you are trying to come up on plane, this should give you the room you need for your steering to clear...

Does this mean that U joint is required in the primary driveshaft to accomidate the engine angle, or can the V-drive gearbox be mounted deep enough in the hull for a straight shot?

[SuperSaltAir]

The angle of the V-drive will take care of that

[chrisk]

I LOVE this idea, it's my dream to have the resources and time to tackle this project... I have to be a debbie-downer though and say, you may have found it easier starting with an old Rider so that you have the increased freeboard.

[Salty87]

space is tight in the back. these guys pulled it off with a nautique 2001...
http://nautiqueowners.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15448&PN=18&title=2001v-drive

might as well be the first here to pull off true sub-floor ballast while you're in there.

where's the gas tank gonna go?

this is too cool...have you started yet?? ??lol

[stinky_1]

Gonna need some work on where the prop comes through as well. The ones on the DD are pretty far back comapared to the Vdrives.

Ill be watching this thread to see how it goes.

Can I encourage you to post pics of the progress as it goes? We may spot something that you had not thought of so you can avoid mistakes. Or at least put a bit of thought into it before your at it

[DAFF]

If it was me I would start with a mock up of the stringers and hull of the boat made from ply wood built as close to the real dimensions as possible. from there you can play in the shop with the boat still up and running.

A built 502 would be a nice addition to the Saltare...

[rludtke]

If it was me I would start with a mock up of the stringers and hull of the boat made from ply wood built as close to the real dimensions as possible. from there you can play in the shop with the boat still up and running.

A built 502 would be a nice addition to the Saltare...

I like the mock up idea. Carved foam sheets (such as insulation sheets) could be cheep and quick representitive parts as long ass they don't need to bear any weight. Then cheap plywood or MDF could be used where more strenght is needed.

[Okie Boarder]

haugy,

Check out correctcraftfan.com too. There's a guy in southern OK that did an old Nautique. I'm thinking his was a 351 but he did a lot of research on engines and v-drives. He also had some hurdles to overcome like you are looking at. He might be able to provide some useful advice.

[haugy]

Good lord the quoting system is Fubar'd

The plan is to start after the lake season. But with a newborn that is subject to the almighty dollar. Won't pull a trigger on go until I get some more v-drive mockups, angle, and prices to start with.

The gas tank would ideally go center keel, but who knows how it may have to end up.

As for the length of where the prop comes in, there are V-drives and remote V-drives. If I have to lengthen the V-drive to allow for angles I can. I just would have to use a stubby shaft to connect tranny to v-drive case.

I never was good at making models. I just build the real thing. I can conceptualize it better in the boat.

I will take pictures as I go.

[jet]

Thats the one I saw Okie. Very cool!

[haugy]

I'm not a member on there so I can't search easily. I tried google, no luck.

Link?

[jonyb]

Glutten for punishment? It'll be pretty sweet when it's done though......

[Salty87]

is it the link in my post above^?

[haugy]

Glutten for punishment? It'll be pretty sweet when it's done though......

Well, since I can't seem to get my stereo stuff for that project from a certain guy I know :D. I figure I'd better work on something else.



is it the link in my post above^?

I don't think so, if it's the one I'm thinking about it's a white CC with wood for the hatch covers over the engine. Salty your link did help me a ton. I've seen that guys toys before, either on Wakeboarder or Pirate. But some of the things he did, I liked alot. And me being more of a fabricator than a fiberglass tradesman, that helps a lot.

[Okie Boarder]

I'm not a member on there so I can't search easily. I tried google, no luck.

Link?

Actually the one I was talking about was the one Salty linked up. I didn't even click it earlier when I had posted the response. That one by "form&function" was the one I was talking about. He lives in OK and seems to be quite the fabricator, which I figured would help you.

I know the other one you're talking about. Someone posted that on wakeboarder, right? Did that one have any detail on the build? I was thinking it was just the final product.