New Pirata owner and V drive convesion

[5akman]

I sure wish I knew it was on the market that long, I'd have offered a lot less $$$! It has some issues such as bottom paint, salt water corrosion on the deck fittings such as the cleats and the upholstery is brittle. Surprisingly, the stringers and floor appears to be fine. I'll know more when I pull the engine out in the next few weeks to add the v drive pan (just showed up today) and the v drive unit.

[haugy]

Good luck man, I know we'll all be watching this thread in anticipation.

Since you are a seasoned boat builder you might have some creative tricks around some of the issues I discovered when I built out my design. Rudder brackets too tall and hitting oil pan, angles for clearance of the air intake, etc. Fun stuff like that.

I am looking for a Saltare to do this to as well. I can't carve up my girl, she's just in too good of shape. This should be a good build. And please tell me you are going to get rid of the bottom paint.

[5akman]

There was really nothing redeeming about this boat with the bottom paint, top side corrosion (altho the engine/trans are remarkable free of rust considering the environment), rusty trailer etc. It was however, the big, deep hull that I wanted to start with for this project at a price point that I thought was fair. Had I seen it in person, I'd have offered at least 500.00 less due to the trailer issues. Matter of fact, I can't believe the gal hauling the boat 550 miles made it with the front left trailer tire cocked in at about a 80 degree angle! If it was me, I wouldn't have towed it a mile before replacing the bearings on that side.

I have thought of the rudder issue. Comparing the dims of the BW unit to the other vdrives, it appears that it is much taller overall. I'm hoping that this will allow the engine to sit higher on the stringers to provide clearance. Adding to this potential problem is that I have bought and plan to install your typical full depth, full length v drive oil pan which means the area on a normal engine where the pan is the shallowest (and is now directly above the rudder port), is now full depth. I don't know yet how much room I have aft of the port in case I need to move the rudder aft. I believe that if I had to do this, I could add a plate to the transom to "extend" the length of the hull, keeping the rudder "in the water".

How far did you get into your design? Had you bought all the components? Did you bail due to the above issues? What v drive were you planning on using?

I guess another option is to go with a traditional remote mount vdrive box such as a Casale. This way you could put the engine fwd enough to clear the rudder box. On most go fast vdrives, they are 30-36" fwd of the transom. This then however, burns up a lot of the interior room that I was seeking. And then there's all the hassle of new shaft log and strut locations......

[haugy]

I was spec'ing out a BW like yours. The rudder itself isn't as much of a problem, it's the primary bracket that holds the cable in place. If you have any welding/fab skills I think you can easily get around it. But it's something I noticed would put the engine about 5-6" higher than I had planned. With the BW on the back of my tranny my design has the rear seats sitting over the V-drive. That would allow easy access and making the backrest of the rear bench removable to access the tranny and cooling system (filter, lines, etc). Then the engine would be about 6-8" from the stern of the boat. That should make your oil pan clear the rudder, but not the rudder cable bracket. I would avoid any design that requires you to relocate the shaft log and strut. I know you can handle that ( I can't), but I think that will be more of a headache than it's worth. Plus you're losing more room in the interior.

You'll see when you get in there. My other concern is the hull depth. The depth where the 454 is now is much deeper than the hull depth at the stern. My worry was the engine height. But again, you're a builder, you'll see the solution if it doesn't clear. The top hatch can be made with recesses to allow space, but still be strong. Your rear hatch should sit below the stainless handrail currently. But I've seen some remade hatches that actually had the rear hatch cushion up above the handrail by an inch or so. And it looks perfectly fine, so you've got some room to add a couple of inches on the top to your top hatch.

How are you going to do your fuel cell? I thought about a bow cell, but it would constantly be changing with fuel consumption. Seeing a post about a 24SSV on here and their plastic composite fuel cell in the center keel gave me my idea. I could get a fuel cell for that boat, and build around it. Then run the hoses from the current fill/overflow point and be good to go. And it would center the weight. This would allow me to add adjustable ballast to the bow to compensate for the 685lbs you just put on the stern. Plus the 85lb BW v-drive.

Also, start considering an electronic trim plate. The newer Supra's have them, and a few have converted theirs on the Saltares. I think with this design you will regret not being able to easily adjust that plate to balance the boat out with it's new weight displacement.

The reason I stopped was I have a very nice Saltare now, and not only that, but it has some very cool personal history to it. I am a die-hard fan of keeping the Supra's stock. But I'm also an intense customizer. If I can customize something to a level never done before, but still look stock, mission accomplished. But I couldn't cut up a good boat. So like you, I am looking for a dead Saltare. One that I would have to gut anyways, might as well build it up awesome.

As soon as I do, my V-drive plan is back in the works.

Please keep taking pictures, and I mean of everything. In here there are some very creative engineers, fabricators, and people who aren't who many times take the easiest route which works out so much better most of the time. Plus we'd all love to see it in progression.

[5akman]

I was figuring the engine would sit higher than the gunnels. I envisioned a "domed" one piece engine lid/aft deck or a raised center section like some of the jet boat/vdrive guys do. I would like one big flat surface if possible just for lounging around on but don't know if it can be done.

I was looking into a few fuel cell options. One was some small tanks on either side of the engine up against the transom. Using a balance tube and common fuel supply from each tank to a "Tee" it would draw the same. This is not so popular with recreational boats but most all of our commercial gillneters in AK use multiple tanks with a common draw. The other options are tanks under the gunnels but I have not yet explored how much room there is between the hull side and inside fiberglass liner. The last option is a belly tank. Since I'm removing the ski pylon, there is room for a long belly tank. I was also wanting an underfloor ski locker so I'm not sure what my ideal is going to be!

I had a line on some used Bennett trim tabs for 250.00 but they got sold before I got to them. I'll be looking for something either air or hyd with most likely a single plate in the stock location. I don't know if having two tabs would assist in the creation of a good surfing wake?

I was going to do as you said with the rear bench base sitting overtop of the v drive. Pop the entire back seat out and engine cover off, and the world is at your fingers!

I had also thought of tearing up the floor outboard of the engine stringers on either side of the engine. Then building a box up about 10" taller than the current floor level and extending up under the rear seat (center section of rear seat base gives access to vdrive, outboard areas are incorporated into balllast). I was considering using this area as a ballast tanks on each side. I haven't gone far enough to calculate volume so it may not be worth it. Any thoughts?

[5akman]

Well, the project has taken a turn for the worse. I purchased the v drive off of ebay back in mid Nov. I kept asking where it was and got lots of excuses on why it hadn't been shipped. He finally got it shipped out and it arrived via freight line COD! I had paid 200.00 within the ebay auction for shipping and then an extra 100.00 to get it from FL to CA that I paid via Paypal. I immediately opened a case with ebay and his PP funds were frozen. He stated at least twice a day that he'd pay for the shipping with his credit card over the phone. Never happened. He then contacted me to say that since his PP funds were frozen due to my open case, that he had no way of paying shipping unless I closed the case. I foolishly did that and still no payment. He then went on about 3-5 days about paying via Western Union, this never happened either. I was now able to go back through ebay and PP to get refunded in full! What a Christmas present as I was out 1300.00! Anyway, the tranny sits here in town awaiting the 300.00+ payment to release it. Since he shipped it COD, I have the ultimate control here as it does not get shipped back until I sign off on it!

Lesson learned? Check the feedback of all sellers. His was questionable but he looked like a marine parts dealer so I felt ok. He just got more neg feedback a few days ago and I asked ebay to shut him down.

Anyway, I'm now shopping for another v drive tranny or I'll just have to stick to the stock engine configuration. Anyone have any leads?

[Ptownkid]

Yeah, as far as PP cases go...don't ever close them until a satisfactory resolution is reached. There's no way that the claim had any effect on his ability to make a payment out in the real world. The only thing PP does is freeze the funds in his PP account, they can't touch his CC or bank account. Pretty sure the shipping company probably does not take PP as a form of payment.

I wouldn't neccesarily say that he is trying to rip you off outright...he did actually send the tranny right? He's just probably already spent the money he SHOULD have used for xmas gifts and is now in a bind. I would venture to guess that anyone trying to rip someone off would NOT ship something...

Is it possible that he can still remedy the situation? As far as I can tell, you paid $300 in shipping fees so at the moment he is going to have to pay at least $600 to get his tranny back. One would think that he's going to pony up the $300 at some point in order to get $1000.

[5akman]

The reason I said he was ripping me off was because of the two weeks or so of "Yea Lance, I'll get that taken care of today" and then another lie the next day and never a payment made.... He'll need to spend 650.00 to get it back to FL according to what the shipping company told me.

[Ptownkid]

I feel for you man...had my share of bad experiences and false promises with online transactions. Is there any chance of it working out still?

[5akman]

I've got a rating of over 800 with 100% feedback, he now has a 100 rating with 93% feedback so I've been lucky so far! After dealing with this guy, I have real concern on whether or not the unit is truly factory rebuilt with only 75hrs of run time on it. I believe I'll keep looking and if I don't find something by spring, I'll just run it with the original running gear...