General run down on a new boat and payment..

[Seabeejamie]

Wow Carzin...kind of harsh bud!
But I hear you, as well as everyone else. It sounds like you are pretty well cushioned on your finances, and could accept a loss if you had to. I know for myself, before jumping into a 70K loan, I ahve to play the "what-if" game. I'm not poor, but I'm certainly not as well off as you seem to be. Additionally, I have to deploy overseas every three years (military). On this boat, i kind of went both routes. I bought an IO that someone didnt winterize for 1500, replaced the engine and interior, used it for a tyear then sold it for 9500. took that money, put it down on my 2002 Launch (in 2005). total price on the boat was 27k, so i financed about 20k after TTL. made the last payment in march, and the boat is still worth 23k (30 according to NADA) so i consider it a win. I try and limit my exposure to interest. This loan was a 12 year loan, which is actually the norm in the RV world. banks try and not to expose you to a high payment, less risk of default. I just doubled and tripled payments and paid it off 6 years early, half the original length of the loan. I love the boat, and will probably keep it 4-5 more years, havent seen anything I would want more yet so the "grass is not yet greener". I will say I probably wouldnt buy a new one. The Supra's depreciate a LOT in the first 3 years, then level off.

[jsandy]

Since i sale Supras for a living i can only give a slightly biased veiw. But the standard for us is 10% down 5.5 - 4.5 depending on credit score and 15 years is the norm. This is all well and good for people if boat prices stay the same or go up but the people that buy and plan to sale in 3-5 years are really gambling on oil and luxury items to stay cheap and desirable. Personally i'm a Dave Ramsey fan and wont take a loan for anything other than a house. And at 24 mine is halfway paid off already (bought at 19) and appraised for 92. But in the end it is your money and i have no place to judge or tell you what to do with it. To quote the great Charles Barkley, "Nobody cared how i spent my money when i was poor, so why do they give a damn how i spend it when i'm rich"

[jsandy]

I would'nt say they depreciate alot in 3 years. Compared to a car or RV its about the safest toy you can buy

[Seabeejamie]

compared to RV's...you are right. As far as depreciation goes, A LOT is relative, less than a car even in most cases, just seems the best deals seem to fall into the 3-4 year old range. I'm not the guy buying a new one every three years, more like the guy snapping up the 3 year old one he traded in....gotta love those guys though, they keep it wakeboarding affordable for guys like me!

[CarZin]

Wow Carzin...kind of harsh bud!

By more than one person I was indirectly called a fool, so I don't take that lightly.

Responding to the above, I don't buy new boats either. I purchased 2 years old, and with a significant discount off the retail. When I sell the boat, it will be 5 years. I couldn't play my game of swapping out every 3 years if I purchased new, because the depreciation would be so great I wouldnt be able to keep up. But I don't fault those that buy new. If they didn't, then I'd have nothing to buy new. I actually purchased my first new car ever 3 months ago, because the free financing made it the better choice than buying used, so again, no case is absolute.

[haugy]

What's a boat payment?

[cadunkle]

Flipping for new boats every few years is different. I personally don't see how this is any different than a long term boat loan as you'll presumably be paying it indefinitely... Or at least until you get old enough that you don't feel you need anything extravagant and your kids are old enough to buy their own toys.

On a $60k loan you would be paying $140/mo in interest... Pay that for the next 30 years we'll say before you keep one and have it paid off. That's over $50k in interest you've paid, plus maybe $10k-$20k down on the first boat. So you paid $60k-$70k for whatever you end up with eventually. This is of course not factoring inflation and assume you never sell any of your 3-6 year old boats at a loss. If you can play the game and never lose on your gamble, I guess it's not so bad.

You still pay more doing it that way than a guy like me who has nowhere near that into my boat and no problem keeping it forever. I got it for a good price, it does what I need it to, and I've had some sick riders behind it throwing down more than I'll likely ever be able to, and that was without ballast. If the floor and stringers ever rot out (they have been redone once so far, previous owner) I have no problem doing them myself or having a shop do it.

I'd be good for life aside from maybe upholstery, engine and trans rebuilds every 10-20 years depending on use. I can do the engine and trans stuff myself so no prob with costs there. So over a lifetime maybe $20k-$25k into my Saltare vs $60k-$70k in interest and payments on a new boat, whether you buy one and keep it forever or flip them every few years before keeping one. So $45k savings over a lifetime maybe? Over a lifetime it's not a huge amount but certainly isn't insignificant. I like to keep my monthly bills and recurring costs to a minimum, I feel that gives me more flexibility and more savings over a lifetime.

[CarZin]

Good for you! As I said, different strokes. Personally, I don't want the maintenance issues of an older boat, as I have no mechanical abilities, and at $90 an hour, any savings you get from an older boat quickly erode.

[cadunkle]

For those of us who can handle mechanical issues it's not a problem. For the longest time I daily drove 60s Fords because they had nice styling and are reliable. No reliability problems even on my first that had 302,000 miles on the original driveline when I sold it.

I drive an '86 Ford pickup. I built it to be what I wanted. After I finish paint this summer it's basically a new truck for under $10k that's faster, can tow better than any gasser, more capable off road, and of course has better styling than the new soccer mom trucks. I can't justify spending over $40k when this does what I need. In 15-20 years whenever the 460 I built needs a freshening up, so would a new truck, same for all other wear items. Costs would be similar so far as maintenance on that and other things over the life of the truck. That's $30k in my pocket over the years.

I learned to never pay someone else for something you can do yourself. When I got my first car if you asked me to point to the carburetor I wouldn't even know to look under the hood. I now build engines and transmissions as side work and make a few bucks doing something fun and different from my day job. If I can learn, anyone can.

I've only owned a boat for a few years, though I was around boats growing up. I don't see how a boat is be any different from a car or truck. My old boat has room for more people than I ever have with me, can make a bigger wake than I'll ever need, and has newer stringers, floors, and engine, Perfect Pass, etc.. I don't need to spend that extra $45k over my lifetime on new boats.

If you're rich, go for it. Personally I'm not rich. If I was, I'd probably pay someone else to restore old classics for me, at least the body work and other parts that I hate doing. Either way, saving money on these things means I can do what I enjoy now, and save for what I want later.

For me that could mean realizing my dream of living on a lake. Those tens of thousands saved over the years are slowly building up to buy a lake house and relocate. Maybe some day I can wake up every morning, look out the window at my old paid for boat at my dock, and take a quick set on morning butter before work. I'd take that even with a junky old 16' two stroke outboard any day over towing a new Wakesetter to the water with a new diesel. Saying a lot of people here are speaking out of their ass is pretty harsh, as most people can't spend $70k for a new boat and have to bust their ass both at work and in their "free time", on their boat and other things, to be able to enjoy being on the water.

[CarZin]

Ugh. Do I have to connect all the dots? I was only aiming the 'speaking out of their ass' statement towards the people that made sweeping judgements about certain financing options.

I'm done with this thread.